The Legend of Zelda: Breath of the Wild (NS/WiiU)


  • Global Moderator

    @mbun

    Would you though?... At least with weapons with durability it leads to scenarios like disarming your enemy and stealing their weapon to fight them with or looking at a threat and going "I should switch to this weapon I've been holding onto as they're effective against these enemies."

    Ya, I'd still prefer without degradation. As you mentioned, if you've a weapon that does more damage on a certain enemy, you'll switch to that. As for the master Sword, I only used it when it did double damage, otherwise I wouldn't. I just didn't feel like the combat was deep enough for me to think, oh ya, this weapon will be great here. I just looked at what did the most damage and that worked pretty much every time.

    I literally got down to half a heart left and beat the enemy by smashing my final weapon across it with the crit damage from the weapon breaking being just enough to finish it, and it was thrilling. Now, I wasn't as thrilled later on running into lots of these same cookie cutter Shrines when I had so many hearts and such good gear they no longer posed any sort of threat to me, so I do wish there were less of them in general, but that one amazing multistage fight of my first encounter with it when I was technically too weak for it was absolutely worth the experience.

    That's totally fair. You had a great experience with one. I never really felt that way throughout the game just because the autosave feature is so generous that when you die, you'll just restart there again and overall I either found that I was so weak that I'd have no weapons left to fight with or I was so OP that it was a breeze.

    Hearts and Stamina are one progression...

    Yes, you're correct on all the progression you mentioned. It's not necessarily what I'm looking for though. I'll give an example to be more specific. When I play something like The Witness, you get a set of puzzles and you get a better understanding of these puzzles the more you do. Then you see them used somewhere else with another puzzle and that information you learned earlier, is still useful now. I love that. With BotW, a person can go into any shrine, cook any meal etc and it's a completely singular thing which is fantastic for someone who just wants to pick up and play but for me, I love that feeling of improving at something.

    Maybe you, but I know I certainly got better at traversing the world. I learned how to go through terrain much more efficiently, a necessity earlier in the game when you have very limited stamina, and still use later on when you have tons of stamina to breeze through the world like a bullet, to the point where a horse would only slow you down. Got much better with the bow as well and knowing when to use it and when not to as arrows are such a precious commodity, even late into the game. No more getting zapped and dropping stuff, because you know to use a ranged option to dispatch those types of enemies instead. You also know not to waste weapon durability on ChuChu, because you can easily take them out with bombs instead. You start putting mental sticky notes on every weapon you pick up, knowing exactly what scenario you're saving it for.

    Sure, these are all things that make you more efficient at the game. Even if you didn't take any of this onboard, you'd still have no issue imo because you pick up so many items everywhere you go anyway. Also, just a quick side note, horses are awful in this game. I forgot about one side quest with a horse, jumping over fences and for some reason, this one on a slight hill would always just make the horse stop. That was 1 of 2 times I really hated the game. Other being the first motion Shrine which was essentially unplayable in handheld mode.

    Story progression is mostly in harder enemies appearing, including the Yiga Clan starting to pop up places which eventually ramps up in frequency, and while that isn't much it is because the story is about you becoming stronger to take down Ganon, which everything you're doing lends to that goal at the end of the road. Yes, you can get reckless as a player after Mipha can just revive you when you die most of the time, but the whole point of that is you earning that power to have a slightly better chance against Ganon and his minions. That's a progression, although obviously generally agreed to be one of the game's weaker sides, a concession made to facilitate the game's extremely open nature.

    I feel like they still could of given us something interesting. Bar maybe 1-2 memories, I didn't find any of the characters interesting and going through Zelda's search of her powers, it just never felt important.

    The runes you get at the very beginning and things you get after Divine Beasts from the Champions are your traditional "skills" you'd find in other games, but what I love is the skills you and others discover and are still discovering while they play from playing with what the game allows you to do and combining elements to pull of crazy stuff. Saw one of the other day where someone figured out you can toss a boomerang straight up and then move a certain pattern to make it spin around you lots in a row, heavily damaging enemies around you. Saw another where bailing from a shield surf spin at the right time would make Link perfectly vault over a wall horizontally that would normally be impassible height. The game is full of these things to discover if you play with the systems available, and while there might not be a shield charge that inflict six seconds of cold damage over time with a cooldown mapped to a button, you can pull out an ice weapon and freeze an enemy with a single attack before switching to a Korok Leaf and blowing the frozen enemy sculpture off a mountain, shattering it below. It rewards experimentation and creativity, and the progression is you discovering and learning these fun tricks to pull off.

    For sure, the cool thing about this game is how creative people can get. That's awesome.



  • @tokeeffe9 said:

    something like The Witness, you get a set of puzzles and you get a better understanding of these puzzles the more you do. Then you see them used somewhere else with another puzzle and that information you learned earlier, is still useful now

    That's basically what Korok puzzles are. There's also some lesser instances of finding shrines where learning stuff earlier will help you find another that's slightly more well hidden. A couple of the Shrine interiors themselves also build on one another, but they're spaced so far apart and you're able to run into them in any order that you could easily never know. I do think the devs attempted to place the simpler Shrines in the world in a way that they would be found first though as some are straight up in plain sight, while others are tucked away.

    That Shrine I mentioned with the thrilling fight was in plain sight, but it was all the way at one edge of the map, and me choosing to run across the map to reach it at that point in the game was a very conscious decision through a very dangerous path. That said, I couldn't tell from afar that it was a combat Shrine and might've thought twice had I known in advance, but by the time I reached it I knew I wasn't turning back.

    With BotW, a person can go into any shrine, cook any meal etc and it's a completely singular thing which is fantastic for someone who just wants to pick up and play but for me, I love that feeling of improving at something.

    Not that it takes super long to grasp, but you definitely don't learn optimal cooking from a single meal. It does take some trial and error as you discover ingredients and how to combine them well, and that's ignoring the straight up recipes on the walls of the stables that you can screenshot for later reference.

    Also, just a quick side note, horses are awful in this game.

    They have uses early game, but once you get decent stamina they only slow you down, least until you get the Ancient Saddle and Bridle so you can teleport them to you.

    I forgot about one side quest with a horse, jumping over fences and for some reason, this one on a slight hill would always just make the horse stop.

    There's a I think shoulder button you can hold that helps horses deal with terrain that's difficult for them, but they balanced it by making the horse move extremely slow when using it, so it isn't super useful for what you mentioned specifically. They are a bit unwieldy overall, but I still like them more than the Master Cycle Zero cause you don't have to hold a button down continuously to make them go, which frees your finger to attack while riding instead.

    I feel like they still could of given us something interesting.

    Game was already way over planned production schedule. Who knows how much planned stuff was scrapped or how late the story we did get was implemented. I wholly expect the next game to fix stuff like this as they have the base for the game finished already and can focus on everything else this time.

    going through Zelda's search of her powers, it just never felt important

    It is basically all for the moment of the final memory, but yea I wasn't a big fan of this Zelda. The diaries you find just make her seem like more of a brat, but I guess in the end she stepped up to fulfill her duty so that's some slight character redemption.


  • Global Moderator

    I do want to emphasis that I had a great time playing this game and I'm totally onboard with them continuing the Zelda formula like this, as opposed to something like Odyssey where I hope that's just a one off. Personally I'd be hoping they remove the weapon degradation and while they don't need to bring back dungeons necessarily, I hope they have areas that size with that level of challenge.



  • @tokeeffe9 said:

    I do want to emphasis that I had a great time playing this game and I'm totally onboard with them continuing the Zelda formula like this

    Yeah, I just like discussing this stuff.

    as opposed to something like Odyssey where I hope that's just a one off

    ˢᵃᵐᵉ
    same

    S A M E

    Personally I'd be hoping they remove the weapon degradation

    I don't want to see it removed entirely, but I do think it'd be good to add NPCs that can repair weapons you become attached to and maybe even forge others from scratch once you find blueprints or something. Master Sword becoming unbreakable with no cooldown periods also wouldn't bother me. It is silly how it has to teleport back to recover now.

    while they don't need to bring back dungeons necessarily, I hope they have areas that size with that level of challenge

    Personally, I want more underground areas and more caves. Less holes in the wall with bombable rocks, and more passages through a wall with bombable rocks leading somewhere new.



  • Good talk guys, that was interesting to read!

    I'm one of those who loooooved Breath of the Wild and yet I can't fully disagree with much of what @tokeeffe9 said. I guess what it boils down to is how much the game's flaws affect your enjoyment.

    About the weapon degradation, my gut feeling tells me they realized it could be an annoyance, but the alternative - letting players find a weapon they like and keep it until the end of the game - would have heavily reduced the need to explore the world and that would have been even more detrimental to the overall experience. They wanted to maintain this "survival" feeling throughout the game and that's a tricky balance to find when you also want to provide progression to the player (which they did through hearts and stamina). Something had to give and it was weapons. Hopefully they come up with a more elegant and less divisive solution for the next game.

    It's actually very exciting to think about the inevitable sequel. The template laid out by BotW was already masterful in my opinion, so imagine a game that irons out all the kinks and improves on its strengths. GOTY 2020.


  • Global Moderator

    Possibly although I never felt like I was exploring to find new weapons, it was just that there are enemies and they have weapons.



  • @tokeeffe9 early on you def hunt around for weapons. Once you get a good grasp of the world its less of a thing



  • @tokeeffe9 There's specific places on the map where weapons will always be if you go back there, which is cool when you find a spot for a great flamesword or such. Always mark the ones I find with the sword icon on the map to keep track of. Early game I think I got most my weapons from chests, especially the challenge chest of every Shrine. Those usually had some good stuff. Late game I think just jacking ones from enemies is best since the stats on them can get ridiculously high. Got a one handed sword from a Lynel that did over 100 damage per hit once. Used it for the final boss of the last DLC.