Persona 5 (PS4/PS3)



  • @TokyoSlim While i do think they are a huge improvement, I feel like there's a clear difference between the quality level of the different Palaces, particularly Kamoshida's which I thought was incredibly well done, and others which I definitively find have some issues with, in any case it is definitively part of the continous improvement on the series, and personally this issues have never stopped these games from being my favorites games.



  • I honestly don't feel like the level design of Kamoshida's palace was anything special, comparitively. It's just that Kamoshida himself was such a good villain that made me like fighting through his twisted perceptions of reality more. IMO I just thought a few palaces were overlong and used mechanics like backtracking to make them longer.



  • I'd honestly say the best palace was the 4th. Not only do you have a different reason for entering, you're learning the back story of a party member, it's not too long, the puzzles are the most varied and interesting in the entire game, and that music! The only one that started to get on my nerves was the 7th just because of the sheer length of it. That's actually been one of the reasons I've been hesitant to finish my second playthrough, I know that beast is coming up soon.



  • @SabotageTheTruth honestly, the

    8th

    Was my least favorite, at least until after the

    Velvet room reveal



  • I was surprised at how much I enjoyed this game. It had some issues for me that are rather nitpicky but amounted to more altogether than an average nitpick, but all in all I really had fun. I'll definitely play more of this series in the future.



  • So I finally finished Persona 5 today and yesterday — my first Persona game besides a couple months of 3, spoilers for the former follow — powering through...

    the false, real, and I guess super-real ending. I spent a lot of time procrastinating with my file saved in the middle of long dungeon days and ended up convincing myself that the story was worse than it is by stalling out in the middle of the Akechi arc before the 6th palace. Naturally I hated him because he kept mansplaining over Makoto (who's clearly best girl, at least in my game) in her own sister's head and because he was forcing the Phantom Thieves to end, which rightly got under my skin due to the entire rebellious ethos of the game. (I never liked Suzaku in Code Geass either and there's basically the same sneak-thief vs paladin with demons, black hair vs brown dynamic going on between him and Akira as there was between Suzaku and Lelouch.) And of course he was just a bad character for a final party member — which made sense when I later played further because he wasn't a party member he was a villain, and all of the villains in Persona 5 are caricatures and not good characters on their own.

    I think the caricatures work for the story they were trying to tell about society being unreasonable though. It was a little cheap of them to kill him off with the plot so the party could keep their hands clean though, but all of the villains just kind of disappeared like that. I think all of the characters they picked for kill off (half of them were just cheap kill teases with no consequences.) were ironically the least impactful to kill, at least to me. Akechi acting rabid and spewing hate? Yeah, sure, hurry up and kill him off. I really wouldn't have minded if some of the real party died or we had the choice to for real-murder the palace targets. That might have given the approval ratings more weight, but the game didn't need WRPG choices.

    But about the fake end of stealing Shido's heart going into the whole reframing of the plot with Mementos — I think it was masterful. An AAA game that doesn't end at its first chance because it's apparent the developers couldn't possible eke another arc out of the production budget, which actually defies expectation and carries the plot further beyond the initial apparent ending? In 2017? Surely people won't vote for an open world de-boot of a popular Japanese franchise for GOTY over that!?

    But I digress. I felt like the first four palaces had a lot less featureless hallways and filler than the last four, or at least they had more bespoke elements and scripted events blended into the level design. However, the last few dungeons were each wholly necessary. Persona 5 is a game that has a lot to say and the switch to the collective unconsciousness and 'god' as an antagonist gave them a great opportunity to explore the truth to some of the dialogue Shido was spouting about the ignorant masses. A lot of the dialogue was surprisingly relatable to me, both the stuff about ignorant masses not wanting to work to better society and achieve their dreams, and the more traditional villain set ups exploring Kamoshida and the others' abuses and sexist as well as monetary/power-oriented oppression.


  • Global Moderator

    Yup... I'd intended on writing something a month ago when I completed the first palace. Anyway, I'm here now and just after completing the forth palace. I've only played Persona 4 Golden before this.

    So far, this game is excellent. It's tough for me to say how good it is just because of how long these games are but I'm having a great time. I've found the time between free time and palaces to be pretty much perfect. It's only around the last week or so where I'm really feeling the pressure on what to do with my time since you have so many social links.

    The palaces themselves are a major improvement over 4. I'm still okay with the random stuff in the mementos but it's so nice to have a fixed area with some puzzle elements in there too. That's just really cool and I hope they continue to improve on that. All the palaces have been good so far too with the 3rd one possibly being the weakest villain wise just because you don't really know or care about them really.

    Just two things that annoy me. The stealth is a bit janky, switching between cover can go horribly wrong at times. I like that it's there though, just again, hope it's something they continue to improve on. The other is a real nitpick, the gang texting you about everything you just discussed. This is minor but god damn does it get annoying sometimes when you get back to the cafe and you get texts that are the same as the conversation.

    Oh and Morgana.. stop telling me to go to bed. I just want to watch a DVD or make some lockpicks!



  • @tokeeffe9 said in Persona 5 (PS4/PS3):

    Just two things that annoy me. The stealth is a bit janky, switching between cover can go horribly wrong at times. I like that it's there though, just again, hope it's something they continue to improve on. The other is a real nitpick, the gang texting you about everything you just discussed. This is minor but god damn does it get annoying sometimes when you get back to the cafe and you get texts that are the same as the conversation.

    Oh and Morgana.. stop telling me to go to bed. I just want to watch a DVD or make some lockpicks!

    I'm finally itching towards the end of P5 (since starting in September) and those are my major (yet entirely minor) criticisms as well. One thing I did notice early on about stealth which sort of negated the jank is that you are always hidden no matter what when you're in cover. You're basically always Ellie in TLOU when in cover.

    These criticisms wouldn't even be a big deal if the game wasn't at least 100h long.

    I'd also add that P5 should embrace the fact that it is a video game a little more. For example,

    • Why not have some sort of action when you're working? The flower minigame is the best and it's relatively dull and I'd prefer not to do it.
    • Why is there a game console in your room, yet you never really actually see or play the game? The choice to keep certain things away from the players perspective kind of annoys me.
    • Lines of dialogue that are very fact of the matter. For example, and this quotation is not verbatim, lines like the following bother me: "I feel like I trust you more". They feel so lifeless in 2017/2018. These usually only happen with confidants.

    But these are my ONLY criticisms for what P5 is and what I expect it to be.



  • I FINALLY finished this past weekend. I've never been a fan of the dating/recreation sim part of P3-5 and play them more for the core Shin Megami Tensei (SMT) systems like press turn and fusion. That being said, the social link system is THE key component of the Persona games these days so I would be crazy to expect that to change. With that in mind, I would like to focus on other parts that stood out to me.

    1. The music: still so sick. The only change I can think of is to add more. Since P3, there have been 4-5 tunes that alternate during cutscenes depending on the desired mood. In the interest of taking the next step, each confidant could have their own song OR a different instrument added to each song to make interactions more individual - like how jumping on Yoshi changes the music in Super Mario World.
    1. Art: Also still so sick. The new persona models look incredible and Lucifer is as cool as ever (too bad about the lack of nulls). The anime cutscenes all look great too and even the lighting during the regular conversations is incredible. I caught myself just staring at the shadows on Ryuji's and Haru's hair several times.

    2. Dungeon crawling: They took a step forward by making the dungeons more distinct from one another and adding puzzles played no small part in this. I still feel like the puzzles were a little uninspired and tended to be more of the time-consuming type rather than actual problem solving. Similarly, I felt like the stealth was a great idea but the execution was not quite what it could have been. It could get clunky to control at times but Atlus balanced this by making your actual location have no bearing on whether enemies could see you or not. While this fixed the control side, I felt like it made ambushes too simple to pull off.

    3. Combat: As a major SMT fan, I naturally love the combat. It feels like they have always tried to steer clear of the long attack animations that other RPG franchises use and, somehow, they have made ultimate attacks in 5 feel larger scale but still have not made the animations too long (see: Morning Star). One change that I am on the fence about is that recovering from knockdown status no longer takes a turn. While this is something that goes both ways in regular battles, since most bosses cannot be knocked down, this change felt like it made me worry far less when a character got knocked down (obviously) and made boss battles a bit easier.

    I liked the game and the new stuff they introduced on the dungeon side of things but I just hope they expand on them for Persona 6 (coming Spring 2028). It's clear that the social link system is where it needs to be as sales have only increased with each title since it was introduced. If they could just reach that same level of quality with the dungeons, the next Persona game could become the benchmark.

    Oh, and also make it like 50 hours shorter...



  • @e_zed_eh_intern said in Persona 5 (PS4/PS3):

    Oh, and also make it like 50 hours shorter...

    This is always funny to me, as I'm always hoping them to be even longer :P



  • @bard91 length has always been a funny thing to some games like the Trails of game and the xenoblade games the 60-80 hours is fine and persona 5i thought was just around the right length, however their are some games that outstay their welcome just to inflate playtime.



  • @ff7cloud for sure, Vesperia is the best example of that for me and I love that game, it just has never been the case with the Persona games for me



  • @bard91 Yeah, it was mostly a joke as it's totally up to preference. Personally, with the modern Persona games, I tend to burn out towards the end but that is usually due to the rec sim parts and if I'm getting sick of that in a Persona game, it's my own stupid fault for starting it in the first place.


  • Global Moderator

    I think I was just very tired and had a bad run last night but man... the 5th palace is rough. Found that enemies were pretty tough, taking a lot of my SP and had to do a lot of running around talking to Persona's to find the right one I want.

    Hopefully now that I'm after a good sleep, I'll enjoy it a bit more but definitely poor first impressions.

    I did like the trip to Hawaii though and all the new plot added to the story before and after. Things are getting really interesting. Although that does remind me of the Morgana storyline which was kinda annoying too but at least it was only a few days.



  • @tokeeffe9 The general consensus seems to be that the fifth palace is the worst and I have to agree. The SP thing is extremely annoying as are the puzzle sections that have enemy encounters that are difficult to avoid. That part and one part in a later palace seem to be what take the most flack online. Personally, I found the fifth palace to be the pinnacle of frustration so I hope you have the same experience - by which I mean I hope it only gets better for you from here.

    I also stopped trying to clear palaces in single real life days after the fifth one and I think it had a positive effect on my opinion of all subsequent dungeons. Good luck with the grind!


  • Global Moderator

    @e_zed_eh_intern Yes the good news is that it went a lot better today. The first half of that palace is frustrating but I found the rest of it to be fine and finally buying 2 of those SP accessories off Tae has been a massive help.



  • @e_zed_eh_intern said in Persona 5 (PS4/PS3):

    I also stopped trying to clear palaces in single real life days after the fifth one and I think it had a positive effect on my opinion of all subsequent dungeons.

    Not only real life but also game days, I really do believe the game is better if you don't force yourself to do palaces in one go, and in that regard I believe the SP adhesives are a bit of mistake and affect what would otherwise be pretty good balancing that helps out with what some people consider 'downtime'.

    I don't recall the fifth palace to be particularly tough tbh, but it is the low point for the palaces in the game for sure.



  • Just started playing this game after buying it a few weeks back, 5 hours in, i'm absolutely impressed by everything so far. I like the fact that you're the bad boy of the school now, everyone's talking about you, everyone's avoiding you, which makes this feels so different from Persona 3 & 4. Previously you're just some regular new kid, it's normal to feel uneasy since no one knows who you are yet, and there's not much controversy regarding your past. Now, everyone knows your past, and they don't want some "criminal" walking down their neighborhood. Makes the game feel fresh for me.
    I also like that it's quite friendly to newcomers of the series. A lot of helpful tutorials are available, and they show each mechanic of the game slowly, instead of just drowning you in the deep ocean right away. Previous games kinda did this, but to a lesser extent.
    I'll post some updates here again, when i make considerable progress.


  • Global Moderator

    I gotta say, I'm absolutely hooked on Persona 5 now. I've just made it to the sixth palace and the story is seriously ramping up!

    Also I've been streaming the game and someone came into chat and said a 'spoiler' which was pretty believable to me but it looks like they were just messing.

    I'm after maxing both Tae and Kawakami and have to admit that in this role play I'm going for, I do find it a bit strange that they can be romantic options, in particular the teacher but I do like both characters and stories a lot. And the skills.



  • @tokeeffe9 yeah, the romancable Kawakami-chan is a bit weird, thematically. But then again, I AM the bad boy.