That's News!

  • @El-Shmiablo I said the PS4 was less limited but still clunky. Although to be honest the PS4 screenshots have similarly terrible compression.

    The Switch capture button is better because you don't have to hold it and wait for the system to load to get the screenshot you want, it's instant. That and the video editor also looks a lot more convenient for editing video length.

  • @Haru17 said in That's News!:

    Although to be honest the PS4 screenshots have similarly terrible compression

    I think the PNG's look good.

  • Banned

    @Haru17 Not sure what you are talking about with system loading. All you need to do is hold down the button and it takes a screenshot. You csn even change it in settings so that it does it with a quick press.

  • IGN - Ultra Sun & Ultra Moon will be the last Pokemon RPGs on 3DS

    "With Ultra Sun and Ultra Moon," explains Ohmori, "we’ve tried to eke that out more and really, really push the system to its absolute limits, and we’re now feeling that perhaps this is the maximum of what we can get out. So we’re really treating Ultra Sun and Ultra Moon as the culmination of our work with the 3DS system."

    They already announced they were making a Pokemon game for Switch so this was pretty apparent, but any fears that it might have been cross platform can be dismissed now.

  • @tokeeffe9 This is pretty cool, the idea that they're blowing Pokemon up to a full-on console RPG is crazy exciting. Holiday 2018 or 2019?

  • @El-Shmiablo I haven't dug into all of the PS4 system settings to find particular options. Nothing about the capture menu would even suggest that it was changeable.

    @Inflorescence The Pokemon Company are not good developers, don't expect a change other than in platform.

  • @Haru17 Hey now, the Pokemon Company are good developers. Their games are very much beloved for a reason. And each generation has brought important changes that have propelled the series forward. People who don't enjoy the series might not understand its appeal or its release system (I admit the multiple versions thing can be frustrating) but it's been very good to fans of the series. Even though Sun and Moon weren't really to my taste in terms of story and the new challenge system, which is the reason why I didn't beat either, and though I prefer pixel art to the 3d style, I and many other fans still adore the series. Despite what I didn't like about Sun and Moon, people who really pay attention to the meta of Pokemon all can agree that those games were a great step forward for the series in terms of the battle system, which is arguably the most important part of Pokemon. The most groundbreaking new systems perhaps were the continuation of Super Training from X and Y which allows players to shape their Pokemon's EV and the absolute Godsend of the addition of Hyper Training that lets players shape their Pokemon's IV's. I don't know if anyone here has ever attempted to get the perfect 6 IV set for a Pokemon, but it's not easy, and practically required for serious competitive play. I takes days, weeks even, of breeding, training, and trading to finally get a baby Pokemon with the right IV's. And then it takes days or weeks to train them properly so that they get the right EV's. Before X and Y this had to be done by only battling specific Pokemon while your Pokemon had Pokerus (PKRS not really necessary but speeds along the process. Then after that you have to level up your Pokemon all the way to level 50 so that they can work at the competitive standard. Poke Refresh which is basically an expansion of Pokemon Amie from X and Y but is no less useful. Most of the battle perks that can be gained from this system only apply to sing player battles not online or official ones, but the 20% EXP boost you get helps with training regardless. In Gen 6 we also got the Poke Bank which is an indredibly useful tool for transferring your Pokemon. Besides the obvious advantage of not having to mess with a dumb mini game just to reclaim the Pokemon you've already trained in the previous generation, it's great for peace of mind. I personally wouldn't feel right without having my first starter in my PC in whichever game I'm playing.

    Before all the changes I mentioned. Playing Pokemon competitively, which is an incredibly rewarding experience for people who get to play it because of the infrastructure that the Pokemon Company has built around competitions , was impossible for a lot of people. It was impossible for me the past 3 years. Playing competitively is very fun, but also very frustrating and time consuming. The amount of time and research it takes just to plan your initial team lineup is insane. The to on top of that spend between days and months (depending on how much free time you have) to actually build and train that team in game is ridiculous. It takes a community to prep one person for their first tournament. It takes research, suggestions, tests, negotiations for trades, letting people help you grind, actually testing the team you've made not only online but against other competitive players, and then repeating the cycle a few more times. The changes made in Gen's 6 and 7 won't cut down on the time it takes to strategize, in fact the additon of Mega Evolutions and Z Moves will increase it, but they will make it so that the actually training part of the process isn't so impossible. And it will make it so that people no longer have to scour forums and the online trading system for the perfect IV baby Pokemon. Hyper train one that you already have (I know it isn't easy to get a Pokemon to level 100 so that you can hyper train them, but it's so much easier than starting from scratch. Plus it allows you to change the IV's of level 100 Pokemon you already had from the last generation.). This opens the gate to competitive play for so many people and it makes it so that the top Pokemon players in the world aren't just people who had enough time to really dedicate themselves to it, it's anyone who can really understand the meta and form good strategies.

    Each Pokemon generation has moved the series forward, whether that's the introduction of double battles that are now the competitive standard, the introductions of new types, or simply finally letting players make their own avatar so that they can show some personality when playing online. Based on their track record, I have no reason not to believe that Gen 8 will bring new improvements to the series formula that will move the games forward. I can't guarantee that the new Pokemon will look like Super Mario Odyssey, but it doesn't have to. They could bring Pokemon back to the pixel era and people would still play it, because Pokemon isn't about graphics. It's about a deep and complex battle system, it's about the story you create and the bond you forge with your team and other players, and most importantly, it's about the Pokemon.

    Sorry for this long post, I meant to keep it short but I just kept writing.

  • @michemagius pokemon company make a lot of crap as well.

  • @ib0show Like what? Honestly? I can't think of a mainline Pokemon game that has been bad. I've played all of them, and liked them all. Gen 1 and 2 are certainly outdated but very good for their time. And even though Sun and Moon are my least favorite games in the series in terms of story and progression, they have the best battle and training system of any game in the series. So groundbreaking for competitive play it allowed people like me who are older and have jobs/secondary education taking up a lot of their time to play again. As for the spinoffs, no they're not as good as the mainline games but you don't judge a series by it's spinoffs. Street Fighter 2010 and Street Fighter: The Movie (the game) are absolute garbage, the Zelda CDI games are certifiably worse than trash, Hotel Mario is widely regarded as possibly the worst game EVER MADE. And yet Street Fighter, Zelda, and Mario are all considered excellent series, some of the greatest series that gaming has to offer. Even when Pokemon spinoffs aren't as good as the mainline games they usually aren't full on garbage. If we let spinoffs decide whether or not a series was good there would be very few series that were considered worth people's time.

    Besides that point, a lot of Pokemon Spinoffs are pretty excellent. The Mystery Dungeon games are some of my most treasured gaming experiences from childhood. Mystery Dungeon: Blue Rescue Team changed me as a person. The Pokemon Ranger games are unusual but fun. Pokemon Pinball are awesome. The TCG games are old and outdated but served their purpose well. Pokemon Snap is beloved by many. Hey You Pikachu is strange, but novel. The PokePark games are wonderful, you can ask Kyle, they aren't "great" games, they won't get high review scores or anything but they're a jolly experience, and kids will enjoy them. And that's something else you have to understand about the Pokemon spinoffs, most of them aren't made for people above the age of 12. They're made for kids who are too young to fully grasp the concept and gameplay of the mainline games but like Pokemon anyway. There are a few of course that are just made for people who are already a fan of Pokemon and play the mainline games, and those games are awesome. Pokemon Conquest is one of the best crossover games ever made, it is amazing, and I will fight anyone who says otherwise. Then of course there are the fan service games. Just games for Pokemon fans of all ages to geek out over having new interactive experiences with Pokemon. Namely, Hey You Pikachu and the Pokemon Channel. Are either of these games even really games? Do they give the player any greater understanding of Pokemon or its world? No! But hell if I didn't enjoy every moment I spent with those games as a 3 and 6 year old. I can barely remember those games but all anyone can ever tell me about them is how much I loved to watch my cousins play them. They were my first introduction to Pokemon, a series that has shaped my life and I will always be grateful to them as a result.

    So no, not every game the Pokemon Company has ever made has been amazing. Not all of them can be winners. But what is clear, is that the Pokemon games are all made for fans enjoyment, regardless of age or gaming skill. The games you call crap might be some 6 year old's favorite game in the world. Just because it was made for children or it was made for hardcore fans, not the mainstream public, does not make a game "crap". I know that there are bad Pokemon spinoff games, I'm sure that Pokemon Rumble is bland and uninspired, but there are worse spinoff games out there, and for very highly regarded series.

    So to close I'll repeat my earlier point: SPINOFFS DO NOT DETERMINE THE VALUE OF A SERIES ON THE WHOLE.

  • @michemagius Good developer makes good games, no excuses. Spin-off or not

  • Banned

    @Haru17 Why would you need to dig into options?
    The default method works in EXACTLY the same way the Switch does.
    Still waiting to hear what makes the PS4's screenshot method "clunky" compared to the Switch.

  • @ib0show said in That's News!:

    @michemagius Good developer makes good games, no excuses. Spin-off or not

    That's a very black and white way of looking at the output of a studio. Pretty much all developers/publishers that have been around as long as the Pokemon Company and Game Freak have made both good and bad games. Often a bad game gives the people behind it valuable lessons that are carried forward to make bigger and better games.

    Also one person's trash is another's treasure and all that.

  • Banned

    @michemagius GameFreak made Tembo the Badass Elephant.
    Good developers (though to be honest I've never seen Pokemon as anything more than an incredibly middling RPG) can make bad games.

  • @El-Shmiablo said in That's News!:

    @Haru17 Why would you need to dig into options?
    The default method works in EXACTLY the same way the Switch does.
    Still waiting to hear what makes the PS4's screenshot method "clunky" compared to the Switch.

    The default way is the laggy hold to take a screenshot of a random frame, at least as of when I set up my PS4 in 2014. I'm trying out the other option, not totally sure of it yet. The issue is that there's still noticeable lag between pressing the share button and the sound and tag indicating that the screen has been captured, so it's difficult to capture an fleeting image. Meanwhile on Switch you just press the button and the shutter effect happens instantly. You know, like using an actual camera.

  • Banned

    @Haru17 Thank you.
    I've never had any particular problem with capturing screens in games on PS4, as most games these days come with modes specifically for taking screenshots, and screenshots can be taken of the 15 minutes of footage that is perpetually saved to the system.
    The Switch's speediness does seem like it would be better for capturing those split second moments in games, particularly ones that don't let you pause the scene without a menu popping up.

  • @Haru17 the notification and sound lags, but the screenshot is nearly real-time. You can turn the notification off if you'd like to spam screenshot button for faux burst mode.

  • @michemagius Okay, but all of that stuff doesn't really... matter... to me... I've played through at least one of the games for all of the generations including Orre save for Johto. Before Sun and Moon, they were all so much the same, and even Sun and Moon is obsessed with maintaining the status quo like all mainline Pokemon games.

    The basic mechanics of Pokemon need to change. I don't care about playing Pokemon multiplayer. Raising competitive Pokemon is such an awfully grindy, time-wasting trial-and-error process that refutes the series' ethos that every Pokemon is worthwhile. They aren't, in fact entire species of fully evolved Pokemon are literally useless. Why can't we change status distributions on Pokemon so we can actually play the Pokemon we like?

    Moreover, turn-based games are too random and unskillful to be anything less than infuriating online. You can't dodge attacks. Even if you execute everything perfectly only complete random chance determines whether you get hit or not, and that's just not fun.

    Look at how much depth Persona 5 added to its series' turn-based combat and reaffirm that Pokemon, with it's four move limit, is being made as good as it can be each time. You even mention double battles becoming the competitive meta — where was that in the games? Except for like 10 NPCs in the each entire game since Hoenn, you have to fight trainers one-on-one in the main series. The Gamecube RPGs just made every battle a double battle. It wasn't difficult, and now they're the most interesting Pokemon games by virtue of standing out from the sea of sameness the series has spawned.

    So, no, The Pokemon Company are not good developers. I don't think you can be and make the same exact non-narrative turn-based RPG-lite for 20 years. They don't need to make new mechanics even, just models and animations that they type in number and status values for. A fighting game, an on-rails shooter, an ARPG, a TPS, an adventure game — anything! I would like TPC to make a game with the length and the ability to introduce a generation of new Pokemon that only the mainline games are permitted and have it be literally anything but the same exact turn-based formula + one new gimmick. Because the setting and the concept of Pokemon is simply so much more interesting than any of the games or media created from it will ever be.

  • @Haru17 What makes a good developer to you? I would argue that you can be a great developer by creating fun, polished games that people want to play, and all three of those qualities are found in every mainline Pokemon game. What is the quality that TPC lacks that you think keeps them out of the Good Developer Kingdom?

  • @Inflorescence The obvious lack of anything that is particularly impressive in their games, for one. Any indie developer or one-man team can make a turn-based game, it's literally one of the most basic gameplay styles that RPG devs have used for years as a medium to tell stories. ...But Pokemon games don't tell stories, not interesting ones anyway. I might consider TPC to have any relative degree of talent if they impressed me or even just competed with the leading handheld devs, but they haven't, so I don't.

    And I don't think Pokemon games have ever felt particularly polished. First there's the whole square grid thing that kept up for way too long, but then there are archaic mechanics like changing Pokemon taking up a turn without the ability to do anything. Not having any clear indication of the range for how much damage an attack will do and fainting a wild Pokemon you wanted to capture, etc. Also, releasing a new gen without so many ugly Pokemon would go a long way toward building some sort of prestige.

    More still, a game doesn't have to be well-made to be fun — certainly not for people to want to play. In fact there are whole series based around that ideal. Anyone can tell you that Pokemon's biggest draw is the IP itself. Not the games or the TCG or the show, but the nostalgia and the familiarity.

  • @Haru17 I would argue that Pokemon games are very meticulously and intelligently crafted. I know you have very particular tastes in games, so I'm not looking to convince you to give them a go. However, there's a level of depth and polish that keeps veterans like myself coming back time after time. Yes, nostalgia and a strong branding have bolstered sales to astronomical numbers over the years. Still, it's a pretty incredible feat to make a competetive turn-based RPG that utilizes almost a thousand unique creatures with just as many moves and abilities able to be combined into near infinite team compositions while still remaining relatively balanced. They may seem to move slowly with iterating on the established formula, but it's unfair to immediately chalk that up to a lack of ambition or talent. The games carry over features rather faithfully because it allows for veterans to carry their teams forward and continue battling with established mechanics we have grown to love. Even still, they have introduced new mechanics that have altered the competitive scene pretty drastically, and the newest title even did away with isometric movements and even the gym-structure. Am I ever frustrated with them? Yes. Do I desire more innovation at times? Absolutely. But I also don't want them turning the mainline Pokemon games into something drastically different.

    Oh, and having a Pokemon not be able to move immediately after switching makes the decision to swap Pokemon a more strategic and risky option.

    And sorry about the long post. I just love me some Pokemon, so I had to throw in my two cents. It's the same reaction as whenever you criticize Souls.