YOUR Desire Index

  • @brannox I'm with you on the numbers aspect, I'm just awful at desiring multiple games when the ones I have are on my mind. I was a big fan of Danny O'Dwyer's short-lived podcast because it was just ranking all games ever in retrospect. Unfortunately it's on (possibly indefinite) hiatus currently, and I secretly wish the Allies could borrow the concept for themselves. Viewers could submit games in groups of three and they would rank each game into an ever-growing list. It led to plenty of entertaining discussions, like whether Mass Effect is better or worse than Ratchet & Clank 2.

  • @chocobop The only recalculation happens when their are games added. After that, it's just a simple plug in and doesn't take long at all.

    No, it doesn't change more or less points, but it DOES help me group close games together AND more importantly than any other point I want to make, it is a factor of EVERYONE The division is there strictly as means to correct outliers. It's a failsafe that reinforces the list's correct order. Consider it a third check after the first (entering in the submission) and second (double checking I've entered it correctly). It doesn't really create ties, but rather makes sure the DESIRES NOT POINTS are the ultimate tiebreaker and as a result, it makes sure, to use your example, a 491 game that has 3 highest desires should be over a 492 only having 2 highest desires. The 491 game wins out.

    For the record, CyberPunk is the only game in the 490s. Spiderman, after getting pretty close has been behind by a much larger amount after the last few updates.

    The only way the rankings change have been with the addition of games. Not ONCE since I've started the thread has a calculation robbed a game with higher desires when it's been close. Also, tangentially, this is why keeping it like it is ensures things aren't skewed.

    To use Spiderman and Resident Evil 2 Remake, the current 2nd and 3rd place games. Spiderman has two highest desires. RE2: R is tied with CyberPunk with the most highest desires on the list at five. That's a MASSIVE difference for a list like this. But why does Spiderman take precedent? Because on average more people have it higher on their list than they do RE2: R, in some cases REALLY down on the lists. This balances out and makes sure EVERYONE'S opinions on EVERY game is taken into account.

    I'm sure I've probably confused you even more despite trying very hard to avert that but I don't know how else to put it. I DO have a question though: What made you curious all of a sudden? I haven't seen anyone care about how the list came to be. Is there something about the list that seems off to you? In 200 posts, no one has complained (And by NO means am I'm implying that you are) about how everything's gone for the last three weeks, so I don't see any controversy, potential or otherwise.

    @robbobwill Yeah, that podcast is done. I'm a big fan of Mr. O'Dwyer as well, and I remember him saying it's practically impossible to do anything regular with it. Especially for him with NoClip AND he recently announced he and his wife are about welcome their first child (A MASSIVE congratulations to them)!

    But to your point though, I disagree, because a never-ending list is daunting and while it may be fun to watch someone debate the quality of whether Strategy Game X is better than Fighting Game Y, doing that endlessly is not really an appealing project because you constantly have to revisit it AND more importantly: Interests can change. Also, from EVERY top 100 list from a publication I've seen, both online and in print, it's a universal sentiment shared by those who make it that those arguments are practically impossible because comparing different games is a crapshoot. The Allies have brought back top 10s and even then those are probably lengthy discussions. Can you imagine what the EZA top 100 games of all time debate would be like (If they ever did one)? That would be WEEKS on just deciding and ordering the list, much less video or stream production.

  • @chocobop The main reason I don't like this is it would be dishonest to people's actual values of desire. Not everyone simply desires their top two games way more than the rest of their list, and some people even have trouble picking between number one, number two, and number three. There's whole chunks of my own list that have much wider gaps than what I think of between the top three, but I can't assign value differences to those spots properly, and even if I could that same formula wouldn't make any sense for another person. It is different for everyone, so the current way is the easiest for keeping it fair for everyone by keeping it a standard "I value this over this, so that's 1 point extra".

  • @mbun

    The main reason I don't like this is it would be dishonest to people's actual values of desire. Not everyone simply desires their top two games way more than the rest of their list,

    That's not what I hoped to capture. I only proposed a small change, not a big one. The changes in desires of the top two would be approximately a 13% and 9% increase, you see? (25 points vs 22 points for number 1, and 23 vs 21 for number 2). So it is not a "way more". [Also of note: every spot below number 2 is worth 1 more point, so the 13% and 9% figures I gave are already misleading in a sense, the actual effect is even lower.]

    The change is a small tilt, and the reason why it might be a popular tilt is best described by the following: Imagine two games, X and Y:

    • Game X is milquetoast. It is ranked in in the dead middle of everyone's personal index, and thus it accumulates a nice chunk of points even though no one is truly rooting for it.
    • Game Y is niche --- a small but sizeable minority fanbase has it as their number one or two game, while everyone else places it randomly in the range between dead middle and dead last.

    The proposed change slightly tilts the chances of game Y cracking the top 10 over game X.


    Also, I haven't stated this yet but I feel there's an unspoken psychological thread going on that I think we should start thinking about. Reread the last several pages of conversations and you find people are openly talking about how they don't care about their desires after a certain point. At least one new person only wanted to post their top 5 desires, and not a full list (thus disqualifying their entry). I worry about the future of thread participation, especially once the Allies stop adding to the index.

    I would like to hear proposals to keep participation (and continued participation) high, and it can easily be argued that adding this ~10% extra juice to your top two picks is one such (but to restate: I'm interested in multiple suggestions). A new person entering the thread reads the rules and notices it explicitly states that the points formula for the top two are treated as a "special case", and "...hey wait a minute it's my top two that I care most about!" Boom, this combination produces a small cascade of brain chemicals which pushes you to vote. The reality that this is only a small boost to the top two picks and not a huge boost doesn't enter the brain's calculations I would assert, so this is a type of psychological trick. But hey: no harm, no foul and we get more participants.

  • @chocobop said:

    A new person entering the thread reads the rules and notices it explicitly states that the points formula for the top two are treated as a "special case", and "...hey wait a minute it's my top two that I care most about!" Boom, this combination produces a small cascade of brain chemicals which pushes you to vote.

    Personally, it seems to just complicate things and add a buffer to super lock in the most common #1 and #2 picks, instead of letting a game that gets more #3 spots possibly overtake it if a couple people don't care about said game. I'd probably quit the thread if that got implemented. If anything, I'd propose the opposite, that the game at the very bottom of everyone's list earns 0 points while the game above that remains 2 points, like if you were playing Mario Party or something and had a point spread for top 4 places, it'd be like 10 points, 5 points, 3 points, and wow you did the absolute worst so 0 points, apply yourself. I'm not sure everyone's least favorite game deserves a token point, but I definitely don't think top games deserve bonus points, they already get a ton just for being at the top.

  • Okay everyone, the Allies added to the Index, but surprisingly they only added three games. Three. That seems a little low for a complete version update, so I'll leave the decision up to you:

    Wait until next week to update, giving a substantial amount of change to our lists


    Go ahead and just factor in the three new additions.

    I DON'T want to provide the games if people think only three games aren't good enough (and spoilers, the three touched on are not high on their Index.) BUT: I'll leave it up to you.

  • @tokyoslim said in YOUR Desire Index:

    Updated for 7/13 podcast

    I decided not to wait just so I can stay current. I won't be upset if we decide not to update lists until next week. Nothing this week scored particularly high. There's still some heavy hitters out there tho.

  • Mayhaps a post from ye olden days hath been overhauled doth reflect one's modern age sensibilities & advances!

  • @brannox All good points! I do think the key would be to keep it on the silly side, since it's quite the silly concept itself. I'd watch it even if it was just Danny's two mates, they seemed like jolly people.

  • 01-Cyberpunk 2077
    02-Last of Us Part II
    03-Red Dead Redemption 2
    06-Fallout 76
    07-Ghost of Tsushima
    08-The Elder Scrolls VI
    09-Resident Evil 2 Remake
    11-Forza Horizon 4
    12-Halo Infinite
    13-The Division 2
    14-Shadow of theTomb Raider
    15-Kingdom Hearts III (Curious to check it out, but I haven't played any of the games that weren't on PS2.)
    16-Gears 5
    17-Darksiders 3
    18-Super Smash Bros Ultimate
    19-Devil May Cry 5
    21-Call of Duty: Black Ops IIII
    22-Skull and bones
    23-Dragon Quest XI (sorry, I think the DQ games are very, very overrated, and also midi music... hard out. It's 2018.)
    24-Babylon's Fall
    25-Team Sonic Racing
    26-Pokémon: Let's Go

  • Version 4.0 is here! I decided to go ahead and update with the new games, which I’ve also decided to include in the first whole version update from this point forward. Those games for this week are:

    Darksiders III
    Forza Horizon 4
    Shadow of the Tomb Raider

    Now with that out of the way, time for notes about a completely not fully representative version of the Master Index!

    As you’ve probably noticed, this list is a MASSIVE difference that what has come to be familiar, so let’s get into what exactly IS different. For starters, Ghost of Tsushima rises two spots to second overall, trailing Cyberpunk by two points, and leading Resident Evil 2: Remake by half a point.

    Another game to jump two spots is The Last of Us Part II, temporarily getting back into the top 5.

    Spiderman was a big loser falling out of second, but it still clings to the top 5.

    As is a trend in this update, another two-spot boost: Kingdom Hearts III goes from 9th to 7th. It should be noted that it trails Red Dead Redemption by only a quarter of a point.

    The first newcomer of the three this week is Forza Horizon 4, finding itself nicely at 8th. It beats out the biggest mover yet by a quarter of a point: Halo: Infinite. The first MASSIVE catapult, as Halo was fighting to stay at 15th and now is 9th.

    Now things get REALLY interesting. We have a FOUR-WAY tie between DMC 5, Smash, Control, and Sekiro. For having a third highest desire, DMC 5 rounds out the top 10. It barely edges out Smash, which has a fourth highest desire to its credit. But Control and Sekiro loses out more than Spiderman did, as not only do both draw the short straw in the four-way tie, but both freefall out of the top 10; Control from 8th to 12th and even harsher, Control from 7th to 13th.

    While not AS much as Halo, Gears 5 will be enjoying temporary top 15 status, as it rockets up four spots; 18th to 14th. It sits ahead of a normal tie by a quarter of a point. That tie being Babylon’s Fall and the second newcomer, Shadow of the Tomb Raider. With a second highest desire, Babylon’s Fall easily wins its tie over Shadow.

    Up next are three games with a quarter of a point in between each of them; first Fallout 76, then Anthem, followed by Skull & Bones.

    Control falling four spots was a surpise, and Sekiro falling six spots was a shock, but no game had a worse outing this time than Dragon Quest XI. It falls eight spots, barely staying in the top 20.

    While not as bad as DQ XI and Sekiro, The Elder Scrolls VI also slid pretty far, falling five spots, out of the top 20, and erasing all that steady progress it had made over the last four or five updates.

    Darksiders III wish it could have had a better debut as it only is ahead of Pokemon Let’s Go by a quarter of a point in the cellars.

    And somehow, some way, Call of Duty: Black Ops IV is NOT last in an update. That distinction now belongs to Sonic Team Racing, all by a margin of a quarter of a point. But that’ll change drastically (like other things) over the next couple of days.

    SO! The big benefactors are Halo and Gears while Control, Sekiro, Dragon Quest and Elder Scrolls felt the sting. As these games find themselves in opposite territory that they’re used to, I hope you come back and update your indexes!

    A quick note to @Whiskeyjack: I did include your list, but struck The Division 2, as it has yet to be introduced on the Podcast. It and many other notable omissions are yet to be discussed and when they are, that's when we'll include them.

    Finally, I'll provide my rationale of placing the new games on my list in the .0 version posts, because I liked reading others' stances, so I wanted to do the same.

    Shadow of the Tomb Raider: As my anticipated games list is much, MUCH shorter than my Desire Index, Shadow is high here for me more so by default than anything else. I really enjoyed the 2013 reboot, and I'm about to start Rise for the second time to get ready for this game. I didn't enjoy Rise as much, but I think it's a decent enough game. Shadow currently sits middle of the road, under the much higher CyberPunk and much lower Halo, but still a game I want to play nonetheless.

    Forza Horizon 4: Not a racing game fan, but I really enjoyed it's E3 showing. It sits in my upper half because I really liked the way it looked and the seasonal concept is intriguing. I'm not going to play it, but it did the best it could to convince me otherwise.

    Darksiders III: I have ZERO experience or attachment to this game. It's just at the top of my bottom 10 because I had a hard time in deciding where to put it. While I desire Resident Evil 2 Remake ONLY because it's so beloved, I don't have that same desire for Darksiders III. It's kind of equal to Devil May Cry 5 for me in that respect.

  • Updated my list, not a whole lot of changes:

    *Spiderman went up over DMC5 pretty much solely because it's closer to release and I'm starting to really get that itch. I bet by mid august it'll be #1 on my list.
    *Dragon Quest XI went up a bit since I think I put it too low last week. Not really huge into RPGs but I mean, I'd give it a try if it comes down to it.
    *RE2make went down a good chunk since I thought about it and honestly I probably won't play this. Horror games aren't my style at all and if I couldn't get more than an hour into REmake last Halloween I don't see this going much differently.
    *I don't care about the three new additions at all, all being from franchises I've never played once in my life and have no real interest in, so they get a nice comfy seat in that "don't care but don't outright dislike either" category. Shadow is the lowest since it looks really uninteresting and Forza's the highest since I probably would actually give it a shot if I had an Xbox One.

  • Post updated!

    @bam541 said in YOUR Desire Index:

    My Desire Index (4rd edition):

    The Last of Us Part II
    Ghosts of Tsushima
    Red Dead Redemption II
    Dragon Quest XI
    Fallout 76
    Kingdom Hearts III
    Cyberpunk 2077
    Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice
    Devil May Cry V
    Resident Evil 2 Remake
    Darksiders III
    Super Smash Bros Ultimate
    The Elder Scrolls VI
    Halo: Infinite
    Babylon's Fall
    Forza Horizon 4
    Sonic Team Racing
    Shadow of the Tomb Raider
    Gears 5
    Skull & Bones
    Call of Duty Black Ops IIII
    Pokemon Let's Go Eevie & Pikachu

  • Alrighty everybody (Yes, I am a dork. Shocking, I know) Update 4.1!!! And with it, the familiarity from the last version is starting to return. Case and point, Spiderman jumps back into the top 3, trailing Ghost of Tsushima by half a point.

    Red Dead Redemption 2 really benefited from this one, getting into the top 5 by way of gaining two positions.

    Resident Evil 2: Remake falls two spots, but it still calls the top 5 home. It barely edged Kingdom Hearts III by 0.2 and KH III is ahead of a big loser of this update, The Last of Us Part II (which dropped three places) by 0.3.

    While Devil May Cry 5 increased the same number of spots that Spiderman and Red Dead did, I would say it’s a bigger winner than those, as it gets ahead of a tie by 0.2. Said tie is between Smash and Control, with Smash having a highest desire. If DMC 5 was in a three-way tie with those, Smash would’ve beaten it. I should also note all three of these games increased two spots as well, but avoiding that tie prevents Smash from being a big mover.

    As is this update’s theme, Sekiro ALSO moves up two places. But the bigger story here is it is less than a full point ahead of this update’s second biggest winner: Fallout 76, jumping from 17th to 12th, a total of five spots.

    What I just said about DMC benefitting from getting ahead of a tie? Well, double that for Fallout 76, as not only did it make the biggest upward push, it’s ahead of a THREE-way tie by 0.2. That tie is Dragon Quest XI, Halo: Infinite, and Forza Horizon 4. If Fallout was number two with a five spot jump, it’s because Dragon Quest came out SWINGING, ALMOST COMPLETELY regaining the eight positions it lost. Still, seven jumps up is not too shabby. And with all of these games going up two and a couple making MASSIVE leaps, of course this spells doom for games that must be forced down, and sure enough, Halo and Forza. DQ XI was able to get all of that momentum by securing a fifth highest desire, better than Halo’s two sixth highest desires and absolutely blowing past Forza’s ninth highest desire. Halo’s five spot freefall is bad, but Forza’s seven spot slip is EASILY this update’s worst.

    And Babylon’s Fall is sitting behind all of that by only just over half a point.

    Shadow of the Tomb Raider is half a point ahead of a tie between Gears 5 and Anthem. Gears takes it by having a third highest desire to Anthem’s fourth highest. And let’s not overlook Gears having as bad a fall as Halo.

    The Elder Scrolls VI is only ahead of Darksiders III by only 0.2. And the difference between Gears 5 to Darksiders III is not even a full point.

    Sonic Team Racing gets out of last place, and forces the two games ahead of it down. I hope you enjoyed such a brief stint NOT at the bottom Call of Duty.

    And with that, I’m off for about 12 hours, so I hope more will update and I can provide and even better update!

  • Updated:

    Cyberpunk 2077
    Resident Evil 2 Remake
    Super Smash Bros. Ultimate
    The Last of Us Part II
    Skull & Bones
    Gears 5
    Devil May Cry V
    Ghost of Tsushima
    Pokémon: Let's Go Pikachu & Eevee
    Red Dead Redemption II
    Darksiders 3
    Dragon Quest XI
    Halo: Infinite
    Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice
    The Elder Scrolls VI
    Shadow of the Tomb Raider
    Babylon's Fall
    Forza Horizon 4
    Team Sonic Racing
    Kingdom Hearts III
    Fallout 76
    Call of Duty: Black Ops IIII

  • This post is deleted!

  • @smoothrunes said in YOUR Desire Index:

    Hey all, I decided to finally make a forum account and decided this would be my inaugural post, since I think the EZA desire index is one of the most fascinating concepts they have done. Anyway, here's my personal rankings.

    1. Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice-it's Miyazaki's next game, has a samurai aesthetic and should play vastly different from Soulsborne titles, how could I not be at maximum hype
    2. Resident Evil 2 Remake-even as someone who has never touched the original, the OTS camera and emphasis on claustrophobic encounters is enough to have me chomping at the bit
    3. Red Dead Redemption 2-the fact that it is currently the closest release on the list (assuming no more delays) helps, but you cannot deny the pedigree of the developer and the niche market that is triple A western games. Whilst being disappointed in the main Rockstar's outings for Grand Theft Auto over the past decade or so, RDR blew me away and is up there with the classic 3D era GTAs in terms of endearment and joy
    4. Control-Not even huge into Remedy, but the premise and gameplay have me instantly hooked. I love when shooters offer the player different kinds of powers on top of a great arsenal of weapons to lay waste to your enemies
    5. Devil May Cry 5-despite my dislike of Nero as a protagonist, I'll at least have Dante and 'V' to fall back on and just hope they get an even amount of focus in the story and gameplay. Just please avoid recycled content like DMC4 and we'll be golden, Capcom
    6. Cyberpunk-despite all the rave impressions, we outside consumers have yet to get eyes on actual gameplay, so there's likely a big difference between excitement levels from both camps, but the setting and tone alone is enough to have me eager to see what this game turns into
    7. Super Smash Bros. Ultimate-don't even own a Switch yet, but I can get down with some Smash whenever the time comes. A full roster with hopefully some new entrants still to come has me fairly excited even as a casual Smasher
    8. Ghost of Tsushima-it will probably end up being a solid hit and it's good to see Sucker Punch branch out to a different style of game in both setting and gameplay. Just still need more shown of the game outside of the combat to see what the rest of the game is like.
    9. The Last of Us Part II-gotta be brutally honest with this one (sorry, Huber), but what's been shown thus far hasn't exactly got me pumped for the sequel to one of the best titles of last gen. I think I need to see new gameplay systems and some infected combat to be blown away, because what has been shown thus far seems like playing it pretty safe
    10. Forza Horizon 4-love me some Forza Horizon, and the fact it is taking place in my home turf is an added bonus, along with the cool new seasons feature
    11. Babylon's Fall-might know next to nothing, but in Platinum we trust for this to play like chocolate ice cream sundae
    12. Anthem-extremely lukewarm on this title at the moment. The actual flying, combat and exploration could all be solid in the final product, but I'm worried about the structure of the game if it tries to be EA's Destiny GAAS competitor
    13. Halo Infinite-sure, more Halo after all this time is nice, but I barely know anything about the premise or what it'll look like, and the last few Halos have left me feeling a little on the cold side, so this ends up here for now

    From here on out, the rest are games I either don't have interest in them/they are not my cup of tea, but I will still rank them based on how I feel they leave an impression to an outsider

    1. Spider-Man-should probably preface this by saying I'm not exactly what you would call a Spider-Man fan. Far from it, but even I can appreciate the effort and craftsmanship put into this title and the E3 2018 demo was such a huge step from the previous showing. This would maybe slide into the upper echelon if Insomniac suddenly revealed that Venom was a playable character, but that is probably being saved for a sequel
    2. Kingdom Hearts 3-never touched Kingdom Hearts. The dialogue and characters are certainly, ahem, interesting. Clearly isn't a tone or style that I would be into. Still, it is the long awaited grand finale of a saga and seeing stuff like Toy Story and Monsters Inc. does spark something in my cold heart
    3. Darksiders III-always appreciated Darksiders from a distance. Maybe this will be the one to hook me in, but for now, it will probably be a wait for sale type of game
    4. Skull & Bones-this earns a high spot on the lower tiers simply because it is a different game from the usual formula that Ubisoft titles have been following and is also supplying a niche genre another contender
    5. Fallout 76-man, I wish this was a proper new Fallout title, with writing duties by Obsidian because the new monsters look dope, but the whole MMO-lite thing is a deal breaker
    6. Gears 5-didn't get round to playing Gears 4 so I can't exactly be thrilled about a sequel either. The narrative could go some interesting places, I suppose
    7. Shadow of the Tomb Raider-I've just never really cared for the gritty Crystal Dynamics reboot series and I doubt this will be the one to sway me
    8. Dragon Quest XI-not a JRPG guy and so am completely unfamiliar with the series. It sort of ranks here by default simply because I have no strong feelings one way or the other
    9. The Elder Scrolls VI-this is too far off to even begin to get excited for, plus I think the franchise has been on a steady decline in terms of RPG elements and quality
    10. Team Sonic Racing-boy, do I hate kart racers! Boy, do I not care one bit for Sonic!
    11. Pokemon Let's Go Evee/Pikachu-never cared for Pokemon and this just seems like a stopgap before the real deal next year
    12. Call of Duty Black Ops IIII-no single player campaign, no buy! Also, that season pass policy is ridiculously anti-consumer so congrats Activision, your flagship franchise can keep the bottom seat warm for now

    Updated mine.

  • Updated:

    1. Resident Evil 2
    2. Cyberpunk 2077
    3. Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice
    4. Ghost of Tsushima
    5. Kingdom Hearts 3
    6. Devil May Cry 5
    7. The Last of Us Part 2
    8. Red Dead Redemption 2
    9. Control
    10. Spider-Man
    11. Dragon Quest XI
    12. Darksiders 3
    13. Fallout 76
    14. Skull & Bones
    15. The Elder Scrolls VI
    16. Super Smash Bros. Ultimate
    17. Shadow of the Tomb Raider
    18. Babylon's Fall
    19. Halo: Infinite
    20. Forza Horizon 4
    21. Sonic Team Racing
    22. Gears 5
    23. Pokemon Let's Go Eevee/Pikachu
    24. Anthem
    25. Call of Duty: Black Ops IIII

  • @bard91 said in YOUR Desire Index:

    Cyberpunk 2077
    The Last of Us Part II
    Super Smash Bros. Ultimate
    Kingdom Hearts III
    Red Dead Redemption 2
    Devil May Cry 5
    Ghost of Tsushima
    Dragon Quest XI
    Darksiders III
    Shadow of the Tomb Raider
    The Elder Scrolls VI
    Sonic Team Racing
    Resident Evil 2 Remake
    Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice
    Fallout 76
    Babylon's Fall
    Skull & Bones
    Gears 5
    Halo: Infinite
    Forza Horizon 4
    Pokemon Let's Go Eevee/Pikachu
    Call of Duty: Black Ops IIII

    Updated mine.

    I took DQ11 down a few places, I saw some gameplay vids this week and man it just doesn't look very exciting, if it weren't a DQ game I probably would ignore it completely

  • Updated list :

    1-The Last of Us Part II
    2-Resident Evil 2 Remake
    3-Cyberpunk 2077
    5-Ghost of tsushima
    7-Red Dead Redemption 2
    9-Dragon Quest XI
    10-Kingdom Hearts III
    11-Devil May Cry 5
    12-The Elder Scrolls VI
    13-Darksiders 3
    14-Fallout 76
    16-Super Smash Bros. Ultimate
    17-Pokémon: Let's Go
    18-Shadow of the tomb raider
    19-Babylon's Fall
    20-Forza Horizon 4
    21-Call of Duty IV
    22-Skull & Bones
    23-Halo Infinite
    24-Gears 5
    25-Team Sonic Racing