Censorship topic (out of the news thread)

  • @dmcmaster I must have missed that. Got another link? Would love to see that live.

  • @luka
    I'll see if I can find it again.

  • Banned

    Don't worry, guys.


    Your waifus are safe.

  • @luka
    So Luka, I just want to understand your stance. If any game is censored on PS4 you won't buy it new, maybe used then. However if a game is not censored you have no problem buying that new. Are the games that are being censored games you would have bought new? I get this stance but I'm curious if this is stopping you from getting games you normally would have.


  • I have a general question for the board, has there ever been a game that made you kinda of uncomfortable to play? For me that game was Dragon's Crown, I love that game, had a blast playing it and bought it three times (PS3,Vita and PS4). However I really didn't like the over sexual design of the amazon and sorcerer among some other characters. I personally wouldn't have mind having the option to kind of cover them up, I didn't buy the game to look at bouncing boobs or shaking booty, I just wanted a fun fantasy beat'em up.

  • @themarcv the only clear example that comes to mind for myself was with GTA V, I already didn't like the characters but when it came to the mission were you tortured a guy there was such a level of dissonance between myself and the character and their actions that it did become extremely unsettling and I stopped playing the game soon after that, it wasn't the violence itself that did it for me, but rather the context and how things were presented.

    I'm sure there are other examples I could come up with, but it would probably be minor things and not comparable to the previous one.

  • @themarcv said in Censorship topic (out of the news thread):

    I have a general question for the board, has there ever been a game that made you kinda of uncomfortable to play?

    God, no.

  • Banned

    @themarcv Blazblue story mode (any iteration)
    I understand that anime fans don't have a particularly good sense of humour, but Jesus that stuff was some of the most cringe inducing garbage I've ever had the displeasure of experience. I actually hard quit after accidentally stumbling upon a nonsequiter story thread where the characters talk only in fish puns because LOL TROUT SO FUNNAY.

    That and Ar Tonelico Qoga. The vast majority of the game is really awkward and cringey fetish pandering, but I think the dungeon where you dive into a party member's head and confront the manifestations of her fear of pooping really put the last few nails in the coffin.

    Also, funny side story.
    Had a buddy over a few years back for some dranks and games. I let him check out God of War 3. When he got to the part where you beat the everloving fuck out if Helios and then gouge out his eyes by pressing in L3 and R3, he physically threw the control down after realizing what happened.

  • @bard91
    Interesting, I don't really recall how I felt while playing that scene. I personally have never really had an issue with violence or gore, I can pretty easily separate fiction/reality so that extreme violence in games just doesn't really phase me (like you mention for you, it was the context of that scene that made you uneasy, not just the violence). With over sexual content I mostly just feel kinda dirty. Like the devs put in an extra busty lady to get my gears going or whatever and it just distracts from the game I'm trying to enjoy. Like Bayonetta, it always just kinda seemed like the devs were saying "Hey look at her, isn't she sexy and look at this, re clothes remove when you do this move" and I'm just like yeah, this is a big turn off that you'd think I'd want to play this because of how 'sexy' your character is. I dunno, I have a hard time enjoying a guy when I feel the dev is trying to titillate me, it's just not why I enjoy video games.

  • @themarcv

    A number of them are, yes. Senran Kagura, Dead or Alive Scarlet, Yuragi-Sou No Yuuna-San, Omega Labyrinth Z, or Super Seducer are just a few examples of the games I would have purchased, either because I was genuinely interested (Senran Kagura, Yuragi) or wanted a dumb game to laugh at (such is the case with OLZ and Super).

    Usually with these games, there are other avenues of getting them (such as different regions or different platforms, such as Noraneko on Switch vs Playstation). However, I cannot in good conscience purchase a product that has been needlessly censored to appease people who had zero interest in purchasing the game to begin with.

  • @themarcv Yes. I was uncomfortable watching the scenes play out between Caim and Angelus in Darkengard. I was uncomfortable when I walked through the halls of Alchemilla Hospital in Silent Hill, seeing the unnerving nurses roaming around. I was uncomfortable murdering civilians in an airport with Call of Duty Modern Warfare 2.

    And I loved that those games put me out of my comfort zone. Games should allow a range of emotions that a player can feel and trying to limit such is an asinine endeavor.

  • Banned

    @luka I think there is a slightdifference between being unnerved by something shocking and fondling a young girl in a mini game meant to be a major selling point of said game but oh wait it's fine because she is actually 300 years old and just looks and acts like a 7 year old.

  • @el-shmiablo This is my fetish

  • @el-shmiablo But you'd be fine with violently torturing and murdering the same young looking girl because

    @TheMarcV said:

    I personally have never really had an issue with violence or gore, I can pretty easily separate fiction/reality so that extreme violence in games just doesn't really phase me

    So why can't you guys just do that with sexual scenarios too? The fictional characters in question you're sexually stimulating don't actually exist, same as the characters you've been without batting an eyelash snuffing the life out of. Not to mention body types are a thing, and it is kind of offensive to consider any grown woman who isn't curvy, stacked, and THICC to "look like a 7 year old". That's the kind of fucked up logic that got petites banned from doing porn in some countries, because men are judging them as looking too close to something they've developed a societal fear of finding attractive. It is fine if your personal preference is the female form doesn't excite you unless she's rocking double Ds, a big bubble butt, and wide child-bearing hips, but there's many other girls of differing body types out there who also need love, and if they're of age we shouldn't exclude them and body shame them for how they naturally grew. This is exactly the kinda shit that leads girls of those body types to feel they need breast implements to earn the right to be found attractive. Please stop sexually harassing them with your expectations of what constitutes a proper grown woman.

  • @el-shmiablo The only difference I see is that something like the torture scene in GTAV is explicitly trying to make the player uncomfortable while pervy minigames in weird Japanese games are just trying to entertain an audience I'm not a part of. I don't begrudge a game for not making me part of its demographic.

  • @mbun Wow that's... quite a leap of logic right there! Are you being serious??

    Going from "It's fucked up to fantasize about 7-year-olds" to "Stop sexually harassing them with your expectations of what constitutes a proper grown woman", errrr....

    Nobody here is saying that you shouldn't be attracted to small-frame girls or that they shouldn't be "sexually" represented in media. Nobody here said a girl has to "rock double Ds and a big bubble butt" to be attractive, what the hell are you even talking about?

    You're purposely omitting a very important part of his message: "looks and acts like a 7-year-old".

    That is the part that makes those games disturbing to most people. And don't pretend like that's not true, it's very obvious that this sort of fantasy is widespread in Japanese media, whether it's in anime, these games, their love hotels, etc.

    It's a very recurring theme for them to portray girls as innocent, shy, vulnerable, obedient and just overall childish, and at the same time sexualize them. Even when they're "rocking double Ds" like the Dead or Alive girls, they all have this childlike innocence.

    When you couple that with an underage appearance, then it becomes questionable. Sure, you can lie to yourself and say "Nuh uh, her official bio says she's 18", but we all know what's going on here.

  • What game can I torture a "7" year old, none because of censorship.

  • Banned

    You know what?


    You're right.


    There is absolutely no difference at all.


    This is all perfectly fine.

  • @mbun first of all I want to say that the tone of some people here is really despective (not you mbun) and I feel that's low even if I agree with the arguments, so I would say we should try to keep low blows out of the arguments.

    That said my problem with sexuality in games is not because of the content itself, but more because of context and tone.

    I don't have any issue with having some character sex appeal being used in a game or for suggestive content if it is well justified and not a core aspect of the experience, for instance I like Bayonetta or even Lollipop Chainsaw, however when there's a mini game specifically designed around groping characters or the whole premise of games like Gal Gun, yeah that makes me uncomfortable.

    On the side of violence, first I think it rarely reaches a similar point where the violence is so extreme that I have an issue with it, and second even when it does a lot of time it doesn't involve humans (ex Doom) or the context is such that I don't have as much of a hard time disassociating myself from the game, the parts of GTAV that disturbed me meet both of this criteria and I was very uncomfortable with them.

    I can't say that I'm knowledgeable about the specific examples you mention in there, and I can't help but agree that cases like that would be an unfortunate consequence and unfair to any woman found on that situation, that said I can't say I fully buy it as the reason for why everyone would find such content appealing. Most porn is related to power fantasies (at least that's my understanding from what I've seen of studies on the matter, certainly not an expert) and it is an unfortunate truth that child porn is a reality and there's a big market for it, and people that are looking to consume it, and I can't believe that it is completely separate from the market of some of the games in questions and that it can't contribute to feeding this sick fetishes (child porn to be specific), now I cannot say what percentage may fall on which side, I would like to think it is a very small percentage that falls on the child fetish side, but I can't really say for sure and that is where a lot of my discomfort with this comes from.

    With all that said, do I believe that this games making me uncomfortable mean they should be banned?

    No, I don't believe my believes on this have to be used to police content, but I'm perfectly ok with a private company taking what measures they find necessary to provide the content they find acceptable, I find it ridiculous to expect a company to be fully compliant to this simply because of a principle of some of the consumers.

  • So, there's a few things I want to touch on.

    I think everyone is in agreement here - none of us would want a game where you're doing sexually explicit things to a child. Yet there have been a few comments here that say censorship is never good, ever and frustration at some of the recent changes. What if someone did try to release a game with children involved in such a way? Should censorship step in then? Or should we be exposed to that as well, since nothing should ever be censored?

    Those "against" censorship in this thread would probably draw a line in the sand at some point too. For some, a brief sentence saying a character is actually a 200 year old god is enough context for them to bypass their looks and behavior but for many, it isn't. To many, it comes off as pedophilia or eerily close to that and it's hard to object to that when the character is being as child-like as possible.

    Different people are going to draw that line at different points but there's also a lot of slippery slope thought patterns that seem to be attached to it as well. I'm always opposed to that sort of fear-mongering (it's prevalent in politics) because the actions of now don't always lead to the ideas of tomorrow. Any time any sort of change or law is proposed, people will say it's the end of their way of life as they know it and they're usually wrong. If the censorship continues to increase and begins to affect things that don't involve basically the depiction of small children being groped, then sure, let's stand up for the right of expression.

    For me personally? I'd much rather shotgun a demon in the face than rub an anime girl for affection points - I'm sure some will say it boils down to that Western preference of violence over sex but the context matters quite a bit.