Pokemon Sword/Shield (Switch)



  • I'll agree that the learning curve with HD was huge. Working in TV, people have told me the nightmare that ensued around 2007ish because of that. But with that said, despite Nintendo being a solid 10 years late to that party (something Eurogamer has interviewed Nintendo about before), Nintendo did in fact get there eventually in terms of HD development and pipeline.

    I don't think "learning HD" or learning new hardware really flies as a learning curve unless internal processes just don't get shared with GameFreak.



  • @dipset Kirby team also struggled with it in the transition to Star Allies. All those franchises where the teams have only ever made handheld games with tiny resolutions on DS and 3DS are going to run into it despite affiliation with Nintendo if they've only ever worked on projects where it wasn't an issue then have to transition to ones where it is. That and GameFreak definitely does things sufficiently separately from Nintendo.



  • I guess so. It just sounds entirely inefficient to me. Surely there is a producer out there who can bridge the gap.

    For example, Guerrilla made Decima engine and it was used across multiple studios first and third party all within 5 years of its creation. Somebody was a liaison there.



  • Yeah, nah.
    I'm sorry but the argument that they are "learning new hardware" is fucking stupid. Gamefreak are a massive company and I am sure they could hire some new talent that are already familiar with Switch hardware (which considering the Switch is just a rebranded Nvidia Shield really shouldn't be that hard) but then again this is a Nintendo related company, and I've already aired my frustrations about Nintendo's insanely archaic, outright baffling stupid design decisions when it comes to internal development.



  • @el-shmiablo Yeah, let's just fire all the current employees and hire all new people to handle everything, then complain when the game gets inevitably leaked by people with no history at the company and turns out trash because they aren't passionate about their jobs either. Why would you even suggest this?



  • @mbun I... didn't suggest anything you just said.
    If hiring competent employees and achieving a much more efficient workflow means the occasional leak, I think I'll survive.



  • @el-shmiablo said:

    I... didn't suggest anything you just said.

    You kind of did. Instead of actively training old employees in new skills on a game or two you want them to just replace them with new hires to do the job for them, which leaves those old employees with nothing to do but sit on their hands. GameFreak releases a Pokemon game almost every year, so I'd say their workflow is just fine. They have two big teams that alternate games so they have two years to develop them instead of just one, then smaller teams that work on side projects that aren't mainline Pokemon. This is like a one time hurdle thing, so I'm not even sure why people are so upset about it. It isn't even like that games look that bad given what the Switch has to work with. They're just not visually similar to games that have been in development for half a decade or more, which of course they aren't.



  • @mbun Actually, I didn't.
    Like I have said, Nintendo and many of it's subsidiaries have incredibly archaic internal design processes. They certainly could train their employees to handle these new tasks, but history (and present) shows that they are unwilling to do so, and so hiring capable talent seems like a much better avenue to take, but I highly doubt that either of these options is going to happen.

    It is almost unfortunate that Nintendo has seen such monumental success, as it means they stick to their guns, even if it ends up hurting the final product.

    Before you try to twist my words (again) I would like to say that I love Nintendo and think they have made and continue to make some of the best games in the industry, but that does not mean there aren't a lot of frustrations with other aspects of the company.
    (Yes I know Gamefreak is seperate from Nintendo, but there are honestly so many parallels that I may as well talk about them as the same)



  • @el-shmiablo said:

    They certainly could train their employees to handle these new tasks

    And they are.

    history (and present) shows that they are unwilling to do so

    But they are, unless you mean "ahead of time" in which case there's no time to do so, because they're constantly working on a new game, so they have to do both at once. The only thing they could do is establish a third main team to give another team a year off sometimes to train in new tech, but there's really no need to with how infrequently this stuff comes up. Just let them learn while doing. History shows it eventually pays off, although I think the 3DS hardware got stretched a little thin for SuMo, and I do worry the same could happen on the Switch, so I hope they figure out ways around that.



  • Also, Scorbunny is clearly the waifubait Pokémon. I'm surprised you had to question that at all.



  • @el-shmiablo said:

    Scorbunny is clearly the waifubait Pokémon

    I personally don't like trying to read patterns and predict TrollFreak's moves for things like this, but here is what I've seen going around from the pattern watchers.

    alt text

    Personally, I see Scorbunny as an athletic theme, so I think waifubait is the least likely choice for it, but it is as possible as any of these and more. Think it would be way too close to Mega Lopunny territory though.



  • I wish I submitted that chart for a Photoshop project in university and explained what it meant.



  • @mbun This isn't Game Freaks first HD game
    EDIT: It's also not the Pokémon Company's first HD game.



  • Ah yes, Tembo the Badass Elephant



  • @dmcmaster I definitely don't count that. Much different style of game for different hardware. I guess you could argue the PC version is somewhat close to Switch's architecture though. Looking between that and Pokemon, they're barely comparable though.

    @iboshow Do you mean Let's Go or Quest? I was lumping those in with this as the period of GameFreak learning the Switch and HD all in the last 3 years during Sword and Shield's development, although Let's Go was probably primarily the second team's work. I imagine we'll get another of those next year.



  • @mbun Tembo the Badass Elephant for GameFreak and Pokken for Pokémon Company



  • Scorbunny evolves into a taller, fieryer, anglier rabbit (Feminine)
    Grookey evolves into some samurai taiko master dude (Strong)
    Sobble ugly ducklings into a water lizard poet with emo hair (Cool)



  • @iboshow said:

    Pokken for Pokémon Company

    Bandai Namco developed Pokken.



  • @mbun pokemon company doesn't develop games. Pokken is the first HD Pokemon game was my point. I guess Game Freak is lacking in the talent department then.



  • I'm gonna rant.

    How to put this gently... That was not an exciting reveal, to say the least.

    Now either they're keeping all the good stuff for future trailers, or this game will be as generic and formulaic as it currently looks. I'm praying for the former but sadly all evidence and past records point to the latter. I hope I'm wrong.

    Either way, I find it incredible that they failed to make me excited for a brand new Pokémon game! This should be a guaranteed day one buy for me, and at this point I don't know if I'll pick it up at all. How do you fuck that up? Remember the Mario Odyssey reveal? There was a "Wow!" or a "Wtf!" moment every 5 seconds in that one. By the end of it, we were left wondering so many things about the game, there were so many possibilities, so many crazy ideas!

    This was... what? Oh hey the textures are slightly more detailed than Let's Go. Hmm the camera seems to tilt a little sometimes. There's large audiences watching gym battles, I guess? And it's in the UK. Oh here come the starters! Never mind, they're the 3 most generic-looking ones in recent memory, and Grookey is a Pansage clone echo.

    Sure, expecting the "Breath of the Wild" of Pokémon may have been a pipe dream, but there's gotta be a middle ground. Like Kyle said, where's the ambition? Why does every game have to stick so closely to the formula? Why 2 versions, in our day and age, what does that bring? Why 3 starters, and why fire, water and grass (I know, they're the most obvious rock-paper-scissors to understand as a new player)? Why always be a kid who leaves home to become the champion? Yes, it works. It will always work, to some extent.

    But imagine if the entire Mario series only consisted of the "New Super Mario Bros" games. That's what Pokémon feels like. Slight iteration, little coat of paint. Oh sure, it's always gonna be fun, but fuck is it boring.

    Pokémon is like the genius kid at school who does just enough to get a passing grade even though if he tried his hardest he would be top of the class.

    Eh, that'll sell 25 million copies, why work twice as hard to maybe sell 30?

    There's so much more that could be done with these games. And maybe Sword and Shield will blow me away next time they're shown, with cool new battle mechanics, actually challenging difficulty settings, environmental puzzles that require you to switch your party around, a mildly intriguing story, fun minigames, whatever.

    All of this is still possible, so I'm not condemning this game just yet. People are speculating and coming up with very cool ideas. But will they actually happen?