Metroid Dread thread



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  • Metroid Dread is one of the Nominations for Ultimate Game of the Year at the Golden Joystick awards

    https://www.nintendolife.com/news/2021/10/metroid-dread-zelda-pokemon-and-mario-all-nominated-in-golden-joystick-awards-2021



  • Metroid Dread joins very short list of games I've bought but didn't finish - I've reached final boss and decided to stop wasting time. I've accepted that this is poorly designed game in terms of player guiding - there are walkthroughs, and you can use them (which I did). I’ve accepted that it’s the same loop “go forward, beat boss, get upgrade” over and over and over again – it’s not very fun, but it’s serviceable. But there’s no excuse for the lack of difficulty options when game is so insanely hard. Couple of first battles were OK, but then it quickly came down to spending half an hour on a single boss hoping to get good enemy attack RNG, so that you could stay alive long enough to deal necessary damage. Eventually I’ve started wondering whether developers know that games should be fun & rewarding and not a labor assignments.

    In short, if you want to buy this game, watch a couple of boos battles first and make sure that you are God-tier good at such type of combat. Otherwise, just play Ori – it’s much, much better game.



  • @ffff0 Haven't heard anyone else with that take. The game actually guides the player more heavily to the next objective than most without straight up slapping a waypoint marker distance meter to follow, so I'm very surprised you used a walkthrough on your first playthrough. People definitely find some of the bosses tough, but there's basically no penalty for failure. You don't have long Dark Souls-like runbacks to the boss to get to try again and you don't even have the traditional Metroid grinding small enemies for energy or ammo refills. You're right there ready to try again. It is simply about learning their patterns and making use of your kit to overcome them. If you're still struggling you can backtrack for optional energy tank and ammo upgrades to make the fights easier, and there's so many packed in the game you'll be really OP if you go after them all.

    Also, there actually are difficulty options, but you don't unlock Hard Mode until beating Normal, which is kind of lame.



  • The game is actually really good in terms of guiding the player. Every time you find an upgrade there is a place close by to wear you can use it which usually shortcuts to the way you are supposed to go.

    The bosses also don't rely on RNG. It's just about reading the patterns and be very patient, only attack when it's safe to do so. They are difficult, there is not much room for mistake so if you have trouble you should play defensively and make good use of the dash ability to dodge attacks. Focus first of learning how to succesfully avoid all the attacks.

    You really don't need to be "god-tier good", I'm not so good at video games and was able to beat this game without guides or anything.



  • @mbun Yes, there's no penalty for failure, and maybe with numerous hours of trying I would beat that final boss. But there's also no reward for success: as I said it all comes down to good RNG, and it's hard to be satisfied that you've eventually got one. So, why bother, I have better things to do.

    (I guess I need to clarify, why I’m talking about RNG. Boss attacks and general strategy aren’t that hard to figure out, especially with a guide. But some attacks are avoidable only technically – they require very precise and complicated inputs that I absolutely can’t perform, partly because Switch Pro controller sucks (it’s the only controller that hurts my right hand if I use it for a couple of hours), partly because controls layout is unintuitive (yes, I have means to use Xbox controller with Switch and I can remap all buttons in system options, but it’s too much trouble). So, to win I need an RNG that doesn’t involve those attacks. Easy difficulty would solve that problem for me, but we all know that Nintendo never heard about accessibility.)

    As for player guiding, I would strongly disagree. Early on the game locks you in a relatively big section of a map, and without any clues you have to, firstly, guess that you need to blow a wall to progress, and secondly, find that wall by trial and error. Player guiding is not either waypoint or nothing – lots of games point you in the right direction with camera movements, with lighting, with sounds, with strangely looking props. Metroid Dread does nothing of that – it wants you to get lost and beat your head against the wall. So, when you eventually find your way, it doesn’t feel good, it feels “thank God, its over”. It’s like solving a complicated puzzle without knowing the rules – it’s possible by brute force, but what’s the point of doing so?

    Finally, the game taught me that collecting every upgrade is pointless: closer to the end I’ve got armor upgrade and text explicitly said that now I will take less damage. The next boss was harming me just as bad as previous one.

    Maybe this game works for those who grew up with Nintendo and Metroid. I’m neither of those, so I’m just comparing it to other games in the genre. And it worse in all regards. The only thing that prevents me from hating this game is the fact that it was basically free (I’ve got it with promo discount and its trade-in price will be more than I’ve paid for it).



  • @ffff0 you could argue that about almost any video game. Have no clue about your complaints about the switch pro controller.

    The game definitely guides you but is not overtly holding your hand. It sometimes lets you feel like you figured it out but it was the game’s great design leading you to the solution.



  • @ffff0 said:

    But there's also no reward for success:

    Technically, there are rewards for success. Beyond theoretical overcoming the challenge and getting to see how the end of the game plays out, you also have unlocks for beating the game, then more for under 8 hours and 4 hours, then more for similar on Hard Mode. Take your pick of rewards.

    it all comes down to good RNG

    Kind of curious what part you feel is RNG.

    But some attacks are avoidable only technically – they require very precise and complicated inputs that I absolutely can’t perform

    What? No...

    partly because Switch Pro controller sucks

    Are you having drift problems? I know the D-Pad isn't great for alot of people, but this game doesn't even use it.

    (it’s the only controller that hurts my right hand if I use it for a couple of hours)

    Must be a personal thing. Fits my hands perfectly, but I also have pretty small hands.

    So, to win I need an RNG that doesn’t involve those attacks.

    Which attacks are you struggling with? Put them behind a spoiler tag and maybe we can help? Most have direct counters built in, and I don't mean like the melee counter.

    Early on the game locks you in a relatively big section of a map, and without any clues you have to, firstly, guess that you need to blow a wall to progress, and secondly, find that wall by trial and error.

    Now you're just sounding like David Jaffe. Yes, walls you blow up to find paths forward are a mainstay of Metroid games, but this game goes the most out of it's way in the history of the franchise to visually telegraph these areas for the player to hint them into finding those hidden blocks. Beyond that, eventually you get an upgrade that can literally scan whole rooms for the secret blocks if your natural intuition is failing you at finding them in the ways the game leads you to discover them. Watch some of those videos Yoshi posted above, and it might help point out to you how much more the game is doing than you realize.

    Finally, the game taught me that collecting every upgrade is pointless: closer to the end I’ve got armor upgrade and text explicitly said that now I will take less damage. The next boss was harming me just as bad as previous one.

    Yes, bosses will ramp up in damage dealt, however the old enemies that used to deal you more now aren't as big of a problem. This is honestly pretty typical of games like this. It helps keep things escalating, but you feel more powerful when you're revisiting older foes, and that's where you realize how much more durable you've gotten.

    Maybe this game works for those who grew up with Nintendo and Metroid.

    I didn't play any 2D Metroid until a couple years back with Super Metroid on the SNES Classic, then a couple other following that. I definitely have my own problems with some of the core design of Metroid games that I wish would get updated a little more, but I do think Dread was a huge leap for the franchise in modernizing lots of things to be smoother on players, especially new players.

    Sorry to hear you had such a rough time with it, but I do think you're maybe "rage quitting" and letting a little bit of the anger from that influence your judgement of the game overall. It is fine if it just isn't for you though. As for accessibility, I guess I wouldn't want a watered down experience ruining the vibes of what the developers are going for here. The game is already crazy generous in my opinion from what I've described before. Compared to the older Metroids, you have no idea how generous it is being. It feels so good not having to grind tiny enemy spawns for 5 minutes to regain your HP and ammo every time you get busted up. Nope, just slam your blaster in a Chozo Station, and you're golden. As for struggling to avoid attacks and struggling with the controls, the map is absolutely overflowing with secret Energy Tanks and ammo upgrades to find to give yourself an edge if you really can't nail the flow of combat. It is kind of ridiculous how many of them you can get, but it is perfect for a player such as yourself who is struggling with less. If you collect all that stuff, it is basically equivalent to an "Easy Mode", except YOU went around collecting them all through challenges and exploration so YOU earned it. Personally, I think that's a better design that'd make eventually beating the game more satisfying than knowing you had to turn the Difficulty down to get through.



  • Btw follow up on my new joycons from the oled switch. Working fine now. Just had a little issue initially connecting them. Right joycon though.beat the final boss and ending section with them.


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    I'm not trying to mean this as a dig against anyone, but personally, it's really weird when people say they don't know where to go. You have a map that fills out as you explore. The map rooms mark sections in purple that lead to new regions, and the map does such a good job of marking items, blocks, etc. I feel like except for a few points near the end, finding the path forward is pretty much always as simple as going to places you haven't been yet on the map. Maybe I'm just so entrenched in the language of how these games work, but I did a full 100% run without ever feeling stuck. Whereas with say, Axiom Verge 2, there were a couple things I had to look up, and even when I did, I was like, "well I never would have figured that out on my own."



  • @bloodworth yeah it was never like a hidden block leading to a unmarked corridor. if the corridors are there you know where you need to go. i think the most i got confused on is when you go between a few areas that you have previously been to back to back and get lost.



  • @bigdude1 Did you have to update their firmware or was it more intensive like opening them up?

    @Bloodworth Everyone keeps praising Ori 2 as a better alternative, but I broke that game like crazy by completely accidentally sequence breaking it while not even realizing I was doing this, and unlike Metroid Dread, that game does not account for you doing so, meaning it completely falls apart technically as a result of doing this with full on game freezing and strange asset pop in to the point where eventually you literally cannot progress because lacking an earlier ability causes a later ability needed for completion to straight up not even function. But more on topic, filling out the map in that for 100% (which I still haven't finished doing) felt like way more of an ordeal to me than doing the same in Metroid Dread. I could definitely launch into a huge tangent about how Ori 2 in particular is not very good game design in many places honestly, and only some of the reasons would be related to my "unique" playthrough. Oh, and this is after I never could 100% the first Ori because I missed something in an area you couldn't return to, something they didn't fix until a Definitive Edition released later, although I'm obligated to say I had a fantastic time with the first Ori and had none of the problems 2 gave me.



  • @mbun said in Metroid Dread thread:

    Which attacks are you struggling with? Put them behind a spoiler tag and maybe we can help?

    Thanks for the offer, but I've already watched last 10 minutes on YouTube and I feel no need to repeat them in-game. Also I've already play enough to understand that Metroid series isn't for me, and beating this one will add nothing to that knowledge.



  • There was this section in first hours of the game that I had to look online (and realize this was a popular search) because I was afraid I had broken the game but no, I just had to shoot a "secret" wall, after the disbelief that this was somehow considered acceptable game design in 2021, I understood that every time I felt stuck I just had to shoot everything.

    Regarding difficulty I felt the game was perhaps too easy. Bosses and semi-bosses were cool enough but the rest were utterly redundant. My biggest challenge was (I think) the controllers, both the Pro and the Joycons felt really weird when kneeling down and aiming but I attribute that to hardware. Other than my issues with the horrible d-pad on the pro this is my first time having trouble with the Switch controllers. Thankfully this is a platformer with no real platforming.



  • @ffff0 it's actually not that hard.

    Every single boss has a pattern to it, the more you die to their attacks, the better you get at memorising how to avoid them until you become untouchable.

    The Final Boss is a dance that forces you to learn and make use of all of the abilities you've learned up to that point



  • @mbun it was already updated by the time I had issues it was just not connecting when I turned on the console .



  • @phbz I still have no idea about your problems with the pro controller



  • @bigdude1 When kneeling down and aiming it didn't felt very responsive and often I had to correct my initial movement. Never had any issues with my thumbsticks but it wouldn't be the first time that a game manifests some controller issue I haven't noticed before. It happened with Minecraft Dungeons in the Xbox and Ghost of Tsushima in the PS. I just find odd that I get it with the Pro and Joycons.



  • @phbz hmm might be off calibration or something.



  • @phbz Next time you're having this problem, take a cotton swab and wipe under your analog stick all the way around gathering any dust under there, then wrap your hand around the stick area making a little seal against the controller with your hand except for your thumb and pointer forming a hole, and blow into that hole as hard as you can. After this, do what you were just doing and see if it is still being weird or not. Get back to me on that.