Metroid Dread thread
its being billed as a best in class return for a franchise
literally no one has said anything like that it's "best in class".
@yoshi If that is how you want to excuse the low effort put into the game, sure.
Mbun last edited by Mbun
@el-shmiablo Honestly though, I think that's false, solely on how many people I've seen since the announcement saying they've never payed much attention to Metroid before, but now they want to play the old games to catch up for Dread. One of my friends was streaming the original Metroid the other night from the NES Online on Switch to do just that and see if they were into the series. I warned them starting with the original Metroid instead of Super was pretty rough, but they seemed to be into it in spite of that.
MiserablePerson last edited by MiserablePerson
I believe it does for multiple reasons. First of all, you have to try and understand the developer's intent with the project. I've already gone into this above and listed multiple reasons why the game might look as it seems to. Beyond that though, I really feel like people who just played something like Ratchet & Clank are bringing those next-gen, high-end modern hardware expectations into a game that's being designed to run smoothly on a 4+ year old glorified handheld.
There's not really examples of games that do what Metroid Dread is trying to do on the Switch that look much better, despite all the talk of "competition". The closest is probably Ori, and I've already touched on how that game sort of performs what it does, as well as technical hiccups I've run into while playing Ori you definitely wouldn't want to feel with an E.N.M.I. chasing you down.
I also believe the focus of this game to be the atmosphere and the story, instead of the pure graphical punch. Samus Returns came out about 4 years ago on the 3DS, so even though this game has been conceptualized off and on for ages, that definitely doesn't mean it has been in technical development for this time. There's no way it even could have been, given the Switch is only so old itself. Samus Returns was presented as a stop gap until Prime 4 when it was revealed, and I have to imagine, to some degree, Metroid Dread shares that fate of them wanting to quickly get a new entry out once they knew Prime 4's development needed to be restarted. That's not to say I think it has been rushed by any means, but I'm sure they didn't want to linger on the project too long after the storied history around it combined with Prime 4's situation. The fans have waited long enough.
Their intent seemed pretty clear from the trailers and commentary, they wanted to bring back 2D Metroid and continue the story. I don't want to, nor should anyone, compare the fidelity of this to a PS5 exclusive, that would be silly. Sad to hear you've had issues with Ori, I feel like I've mostly seen only praise for the Switch version - I'd try it myself but I'm not big on double dipping. I would be curious to know just how much of this game was hammered out prior to the completion of Metroid: Samus Returns, either way I doubt development time was a serious issue here, I don't think it was rushed or anything.
I don't agree with that, except in the very basic sense of them both being Metroidvania, Metroid games. If you look back at Samus Returns, the level of detail is greater than what we're seeing with this game, mostly to accent the 3D effect of the 3DS, although that's hard to witness without playing the game on the hardware itself. If you just look at videos of the game, things will look very flat with low resolution, pretty basic lighting / textures that reflect the 3DS's limitations.
Not an insult, this is just a natural extension of what was a seemingly good looking 3DS game.
I'm not so sure. On top of the basic Metroidvania type game formula we're used to seeing, they've clearly put more budget into the presentation, which becomes apparent during more action focused parts of the game. When Samus gets caught by an E.N.M.I., is charging her powered up charge beam, or is performing special attacks against bosses, the perspective will shift to something akin to a cutscene, except seemingly running in-game, with much more detailed visuals. This is something games like Ori lack entirely, on top of the other reasons I've previously presented for why Ori on Switch definitely is not the shining example people seem to think it is. I could honestly go off on an entire rant about how unpolished that game seems on multiple fronts, given I happen to be playing it currently.
I'm really curious about your issues, that sucks. I remember a thread which complained about the game on ResetEra and it ended up being something related to the physical version, because there were a lot of people attesting to the quality of the port. Regarding the presentation comment, I'll just say I disagree; everything is actively happening, I don't need to be pulled away from the action in those moments for it to feel like there's production.
They've made Metroid games in the past 15+ years. They just haven't continued the story of Metroid (much) in that time, which none of your complaints seem to be focused around.
100%, I'm just going off their presentation where they billed this as 'Metroid 5' and the 'first new 2D Metroid in 19 years.' When I say sitting on it for 15+ years, I'm alluding to making new games. They can sit on it for as long as they want, I don't care, but they're treating it like a big deal and that is part of the pitch.
It is very high up there on Amazon's best sellers. The Special Editions and amiibo sold out basically instantly. I'm not going to pretend there's not others like yourself complaining about the look of it right now, but end of the day people seem just fine paying $60+ for this game. Value isn't determined solely by graphical fidelity. The game appears to run silky smooth too, so from a technical standpoint it isn't bad either.
I don't want to wade too deeply into this, because I agree value isn't determined by any singular aspect of a game, I also think some the games this will be compared to may have been underpriced at launch. On the other hand, something selling well doesn't mean it merits the cost. We all know why those are sold out, and it isn't just because people think it looks good.
Yeah, I understand. Honestly, it is frustrating with how Nintendo games are with sales, because normally I'd just tell you to wait for a sale if it doesn't appear to be worth the $60 for you. I guess you can try your luck down the line on the second hand market. Personally, I'd prioritize how the game runs, feels, and nails the atmosphere it is going for over how dense it is visually, but I do expect the full game to have at least some chambers / caves you walk into that just immediately wow you with whatever is going on in there. Still I'm personally holding off on condemning the visuals before we get the full product, because we really don't know yet what they're saving for release. They only showed the very beginning.
Its really hard for me to concisely explain my feelings regarding Nintendo. Personally, regarding this game, its very possible I will buy it at $60, knowing full well it may be overpriced compared to the competition. I've bought a number of games for the Switch I think are priced terribly, and in some cases I can reasonably rationalize that; it just gets tiring for that to feel constant knowing full well no other publisher could for that exact product. Please don't take my comments as some final verdict, I just thought I would be more impressed at the jump given the heritage, price, and pitch.
MiserablePerson last edited by
Pricing it at $60 implies the game is more special than its counterparts that were released at half the cost and lower for the past ~10 years. If you don't have higher expectations for a cheeseburger priced at $20 than you would if it was priced at $10 or $5, then I don't know what to tell you.
Pricing it at $60 implies the game is more special than its counterparts
cool. remind me to bitch and moan every single time other developers release a game then.
for example. what the fuck is with Final Fantasy 7 remake? it's such a low effort cheeseburger type game. literally pulled that cinematic shit multiple times before with things like FF13, 14 and 15 already. clearly no thought and effort was put into FF7 remake to make unique and stand out from the crowd. just another generic movie type game and they really think it's more special than the other Final Fantasy games? defs not worth $60. ffs Square...
MiserablePerson last edited by MiserablePerson
@yoshi I'm not really sure you're grasping the argument, but that's fine. You could apply a similar argument to a ton of different games if you choose to. This isn't the first, only, or last.
I don't give a damn about Final Fantasy VII so I'm not sure if that's supposed to cut at me, it doesn't; I also think it's crazy how they're treating that rollout but that's a whole different thing.
cool. remind me to bitch and moan every single time other developers release a game then.
I'm sure you'll remember without being reminded.
Going off MBun's argument that people were expecting a Ratchet & Clank situation... nah bruh, I'm just expecting the game to look as good or better than it's contemporaries for the price they are charging for it, not like an early PS3 game.
Like I've already said, I'll definitely be playing, and will most likely enjoy myself greatly, I'm just disappointed that more work isn't being out into a franchise I adore given the fact that they are charging full price for it, but then again, this is Nintendo we're talking about and I'm clearly naive to expect more on the first place.
I'm really curious about your issues, that sucks.
I took some clips of problems I had to show someone else in the community before. Tried to link one with my claim previously, but the forums were displaying it wrong and showing the tweet instead of hiding it behind a link as intended. Here you go though. I've run into stuff like this multiple times:
there were a lot of people attesting to the quality of the port
Yeah, I was only hearing good things as well. Also, I played the first game on a toaster of a PC that lagged during the chase sequences, and from what I remember, I swear the first game was just kind of all around better. I run into weird platforming design, janky surfaces, and issues alot in the sequel. Also, there's weird things like the game suddenly changing the rules of how you can play for a "story moment" that I really dislike and wish they didn't do. Things like you can't jump near this spot or you can't move left during this section. I could honestly go off on it, but this isn't the Ori 2 topic, so I won't beyond saying something is off with that game, at least the Switch version. Oh, and I own it digitally, so it isn't a faulty cart or anything.
I also think some the games this will be compared to may have been underpriced at launch.
Can't attest to Ori 2, but Hollow Knight damn sure as fuck shouldn't be a $15 game. That's easily a $60 game, but I imagine by pricing it at $15 they did way better than they would've pricing the game at $60. Helped more people play it to get the word out more, and helped encourage more people to buy it multiple times on different platforms and buy into special editions and merch and such. Sometimes even if you're undervaluing your game to price it below what you should, it can bring better returns in the long run, and I imagine Hollow Knight's pricing, despite being so obviously wrong, happened to bring them the best results. That said, I kind of hope Silksong at least gets bumped up to $20-25 range, because they've earned the clout to charge that after Hollow Knight.
On the other hand, something selling well doesn't mean it merits the cost. We all know why those are sold out, and it isn't just because people think it looks good.
Of course Special Editions are going to be scalped yeah, but even the Normal Edition of the game is selling incredibly well. I just don't want people to get the idea from this topic, that some people seem to be trying to paint, that people are on the fence with this game. Just saw another video about how Metroid Dread is Gamestop's best selling preordered game out of E3, literally number one. Not just among Nintendo games. Among all the games. While there's definitely people who wish the game looked a bit better, myself included with some of the sparse backgrounds they've shown, what they've shown so far has impressed most enough to where they're preordering it in droves despite that, so whatever they're selling is hitting. My main point though was just that the graphics maybe taking a hit for silky smooth gameplay is less a detriment and more a tradeoff, one that people don't seem to mind too much.
Personally, regarding this game, its very possible I will buy it at $60, knowing full well it may be overpriced compared to the competition.
This year has been really tight on games, so I'm definitely not preordering it yet. I'll wait to see how it reviews and word of mouth after launch, but I think I'm much less worried about this game than you. I kinda of trust this one to turn out good, when in your own words you say you see it as an evolution of Samus Returns on the 3DS, and everyone chiming into this topic who played that seems to agree that was a very good game. Of course, that was kind of a remake type thing, so this'll be a slightly different situation as a new entry.
I still have faith that this combination of developers will deliver a quality new entry. If anything, the Switch hardware itself is holding Metroid Dread back, not the developers. Speaking of which, I keep seeing people (not you specifically) act like this game is being developed solely by Mercury Steam, but that's not the case. This game is codeveloped between both Nintendo EPD and Mercury Steam, just as Samus Returns was developed. So they're definitely taking this seriously. The one I'm still worried about is Advance Wars Re-Boot Camp. Hard to find concrete information right now if that's solely being outsourced to WayForward or if Intelligent Systems is also part of the project. Obviously Nintendo is publishing it, but that doesn't mean much. Have a feeling they tossed it to WayForward while Intelligent Systems continues to crank out Fire Emblems.
it just gets tiring for that to feel constant knowing full well no other publisher could for that exact product
Oh, there's definitely others who can and do the same shit. Square Enix is a notorious one.
I just thought I would be more impressed at the jump given the heritage, price, and pitch.
I really think Prime 4 is the one to watch as far as that goes. The design of those games lends more to graphical complexity as one of the main sells.
Nimbat1003 last edited by
Honestly pretty excited for this, but i am 100% getting the physical version so i can flip it, i've never played metroid and it doesn't have the looks, studio pedigree or uniqueness to be full priced for me(prime 4 obviously being the more attractive proposition).
and it's just a trend i really dont like with nintendo from the remakes and ports of games being full price like pikmen 3, tropical freeze even the upcoming skyward sword to just things having that nintendo tax in general 1,2 switch the only saving grace is that the physical copies hold their value quite well.
totally gonna have a go at super Metroid before release though.
pikmin 3, tropical freeze even the upcoming skyward sword
Pikmin 3 and Skyward Sword probably should've been $40, but I'll defend Tropical Freeze. Yes, it makes zero sense you can get that game for $20 on Wii U, because it became a Nintendo Select there, but that's 100% a $60 game that holds the fuck up and deserves to be sold for the full $60. I play alot of platformers, and Tropical Freeze is probably the best one I've ever played.
Nimbat1003 last edited by Nimbat1003
i will also throw it a bit of a bone because it was early on in the life cycle of the switch(kinda like Returnal and rift apart),
even though i kinda hate beat that game haha, after all the praise from the allies i bought it but it's some of the most frustrated I've ever gotten at a game and genuinely did not like that game by the end,
i don't know why it's a pure hatred in my heart, i don't play many 2d platformers specifically but games like cup head barely bothered me and i love souls borne games so yeah. i suspect the momentum of DK specifically was a key point
@nimbat1003 Damn, sorry to hear that. Sometimes you just bounce off a franchise, so I wouldn't hold it against you. Have you tried the Donkey Kong Country games available on Nintendo Switch Online? I'd be curious if you also dislike those or it is specifically something with Tropical Freeze you can't get into.
Nimbat1003 last edited by Nimbat1003
so I wouldn't hold it against you. Have you tried the Donkey Kong Country games available on Nintendo Switch Online?
funny enough i don't have switch online, and i only every had it because twitch gave me so free months a while back, but i don't think country was available then though i totally played Country 1 years ago though as a kid and remember liking it.
yeah i think a small part of it was specifically getting it because of all the praise from the allies and then not enjoying it, and i still see it as a great game in that genre, even if i try to think what i don't like about it, it's maybe DK's momentum and the boss fights i guess, where as with BOTW i specifically don't like the weapon system and the threadbare story.
Nimbat1003 last edited by
but without getting too off track thats why i'm cautious about Metroid dread, i don't dabble to much in the 2d metroidvanias i've played top down ones and 3d one but in general have barely touched to sidescroller style, and yes hollow knight like everybody has been in my backlog for years.
i only every had it because twitch gave me so free months a while back
Damn, I don't see one up right now, but sometimes you can get Free Trials from My Nintendo.
and yes hollow knight like everybody has been in my backlog for years.
That's on sale right now for about $9.50 digitally from Walmart and Amazon. Can't recommend it enough. Some people drop off between the beginning and Greenpath or the City of Tears, but if you can make it there, I can't imagine you not absolutely falling for the game, especially since you said before you love soulsborne games, and there's definitely some DNA there.
I was listening to Kyle's E3 video and he raised a good point about the Dread trailer being unremarkable.
That robot could be from anywhere. It is incredibly generic and I have a hard time wrapping my head around taking it as a threat when Samus has killed bigbois like Ridley and Kraid many times.
If this trailer didn't have Samus and it was called something completely different, nobody would care. The Metroidvania genre has moved on and surpassed it's predecessors, and releasing something that might have looked good, say, an entire decade ago for full price just ain't a good look daddy.
That robot could be from anywhere. It is incredibly generic
Designwise, that's because it is the very beginning of the game and you're only seeing the very basic ones. They've already said they're going to get cooler and more complex as you progress through the game. Also even if they look generic, which is debatable given I never heard people call GLaDOS generic in the past, they don't move like generic robots. They have a really freaky way of contorting around surfaces to pursue.
I have a hard time wrapping my head around taking it as a threat when Samus has killed bigbois like Ridley and Kraid many times.
Speculatory potential spoilers below:
They've already heavily implied the robots aren't simply the Galactic Federation robots sent to the planet to collect DNA and exterminate the X Parasites, but X Parasites that have somehow learned to take over and copy the E.M.M.I. robots, which I imagine is going to lead to biomechanical hybrid enemies later on. It is one of those situations where the devs probably really don't want to spoil everything before you're playing the game, but they're pretty heavily hinting there's more going on than has been shown.
If this trailer didn't have Samus and it was called something completely different, nobody would care.
That's way too hyperbolic. You know people would care and be interested. Obviously you wouldn't have all the Metroid fans immediately on board, because it wouldn't have the aspect of continuing a story long left dorment, but Metroidvanias are still a popular genre today. There'd definitely be people into the aesthetic of the setting and the atmosphere they're trying to create, but of course it'd be a way different situation overall.
The Metroidvania genre has moved on etc.
Sales say otherwise. You guys are real quick to judge a game that's not even out yet.
Kyle especially. Know what other game Kyle was shitting on and expecting to be received super poorly? New Pokemon Snap. Then it was generally liked, scored well, and he lost points on his Fantasy League over doubting it. This is the guy who craps on and refuses to finish Persona 5 for the most trivial reasons too. He has some good insights sometimes, but you can't always go with his weird nitpicks. Honestly I'm surprised he still throws takes like this out when he complained before about having to react to things. What's the difference between reacting to something as it is revealed and holding that same reaction a couple hours / days until you make a video about it? Unless he's just shifting to that parrot public perception persona to hook as many new followers life. Hope not. Crazy or not, his raw takes are way more valuable than regurgitated self marketing bandwagon bullshit.
if Dread can make this happen on a console with as small a userbase as the Wii U had, just imagine what Dread, an entirely new game, will do on the Switch with an install base of almost 10 x the size.
DIPSET last edited by
I thought Kyle hit the nail on the head tbh. I didn’t think he was shitting on it. Neither am I. I just think it looks like generic chrome sci-fi.