Metroid Dread thread

  • @mbun You should definitely try to play Ori because when it comes to movement and platforming there's a lot going on there, way more relevant to the genre than the chase sequences alone.

  • Why does Dread need to be this unique milestone in gameplay anyway?

    i thought the whole point of people being pissed off was because Nintendo HASN'T been giving us a traditional metroid game? all fans wanted was a traditional metroid game and bitched because Other M and Federation Force were too different to a normal metroid game.

    Samus Returns gets put out on 3DS and then people bitched because "it's just a remake."

    then when Nintendo finally makes Dread, a traditional Metroid game, that's also a completely new entry in the story, people still bitch because it's "too generic" and isn't "different enough"

    Nintendo can't win. the people bitching most likely probably weren't going to buy a metroid game in the first bloody place anyway.
    they don't know what they want.

  • @yoshi People are just complaining about the graphics.

  • @neocweeny graphics whores aren't the only complaints i've seen around the internet. but yes they do make up a large portion of it.

  • @yoshi Nobody will please everyone every time and although we tend to treat the "internet" like one voice, it is in fact a collection of many voices wanting different things. So different people will bitch about different things, including bitch about other people bitching.

    A new 2D Metroid will inevitably create some discussion around it. First because it's literally a genre defining series, second because the genre has been pushed to incredibly new heights by other games in recent years. So when Nintendo announces a new main entry in the series expectations should be high. I can definitely sympathise with someone being happy with just having a new 2D Metroid but I don't think someone desiring to be wowed by the showing of a brand new 2D Metroid to be an absurd either.

  • @phbz said:

    You should definitely try to play Ori

    You say that like I haven't. I've already fully beaten the first game ages ago, and I'm pretty damn far into the second now. Definitely far enough to understand the zippy movement. Not the only Metroidvania I've played with fluid movement though, and I even have nitpicks with how Ori does some things, like two hanging lantern types, where one you press a button while near it to zip off it, and the other is like an autozip opposite direction of where you are. Nothing in Ori is color coded because blue aesthetic, so it becomes very confusing. Of course you get so many tools as you go on that the further you get the easier misread situation mistakes are to overlook since you have course correct options. It is definitely a game where the base movement feels bad, but as you go on the amount of tools that empower you and things like double / triple jump make up for it. None of that would I call especially relevant to the genre, and Ori 2 heavily borrows from Hollow Knight with the Charm-like system.

    I can already feel the angry stares, because you can't ever bring up bad points for games that make people cry with their stories, but uhhhhhh, to say something nice about Ori 2 after all that, one of the best water levels I've played in a Metroidvania. Actually my favorite zone so far.

    @Phbz I find it silly because we know Metroid Prime 4 is being made at the same time, and that's the one with the Tropical Freeze devs behind it, who were also responsible for the original Metroid Prime, so that feels like the big visual showpiece game, while this 2D one is more focused on finishing the ages old story arc and creating the ideal atmosphere they've been chasing for 15 years. The team is aiming more on a specific kind of action oriented gameplay, and games where that's a goal you tend to see hits on the visual front for sake of maintaining a good framerate and overall flow to the action.

    Of course pointing that out sort of goes against the lazy, overcharging, unspectacular Nintendo narrative some people on these forums are obsessed with pushing at every opportunity, so I know that's not what you guys want to hear. People have gotten to the point where they dig in their feet and refuse to admit a game was good even after it came out, defied expectations, was generally liked, and reviewed well, instead doubling down on "everyone else is wrong and just can't be convinced" rather than eating their humble pie. This will be no different. When it ends up reviewing super well, you're going to be sold the excuse that it only sold well because this is Metroid made by Nintendo, as though Nintendo games never fail to review well, which is clearly not the case with a tiny bit of research.

  • Banned

    I feel like trying to explain why people feel disappointed towards this game is pointless here, since several people have already clearly explained themselves, yet some people refuse to give those arguments validity for silly reasons.
    If the game cost less or looked better, I (and others )wouldn't be so disappointed. The end.

    Also, somebody also mentioned they believe Hollow Knight is a 60 dollar game. While I absolutely adore HK, I do not think it should have been priced anywhere close to 60 bux. It's a side scrolling indie game with a Flash aesthetic. It's an incredible game and certainly one of the shining examples of the genre, but not full price by any means.

    I also think it is fair to raise the point that, since this is a Nintendo game, 60 dollars is 60 dollars. This likely won't come down in price for a very long time, if ever.

  • @el-shmiablo You made it very clear that your only qualifier for a game's cost is how it looks visually. Also, calling Hollow Knight a "Flash aesthetic" is one of the worst things I've read on these forums.

  • @mbun said in Metroid Dread thread:

    But the crux of it is Kyle saying Metroid Dread is doing nothing new while praising games like Hollow Knight and Ori. Sure, visually those games have a strong identity, but besides Ori having chase sequences, which this game is literally all about and the devs even had an example of back in Samus Returns with one notable boss fight, those games really aren't about innovation on the genre so much as just very clean examples of the genre in an interesting setting with a cool story. Silksong does seem to be doing more, and in general looks like it has a much more interesting base moveset, so maybe that's what he meant? I kind of doubt it though. I think he's just hung up on visuals.

    I'm definitely not going to overanalyze what Kyle was saying, whether he was being facetious or not, but I do tend to think his gut reaction was a lot like mine. Looks bland, but might be good.

    I don't want to derail the Dread discussion, but I strongly disagree with Hollow Knight and Ori lacking innovation. Hollow Knight's tight combat basically defined the improvements to Ori and the Will of the Wisps being a more well-rounded game. I think those two games have the best combat in 2D Metroid games that I've ever played. They really perfected combat in their own right.

  • Banned

    @mbun If that is what you've taken from my posts in this thread, I don't have the qualifications to help you.

    Also, what is wrong with saying HK has a Flash aesthetic? Flash is a versatile tool that can look absolutely beautiful (see Wakfu) but also had a distinct look. As usual, your passive aggression doesn't really explain much.

  • @dipset I agree with Hollow Knight taking the time to polish the hell out of combat and traversal to perfection, but I see that more as polish than innovation. Someone said Hollow Knight is a shining example of the genre but still isn't worth full price, which is hard to wrap my head around. Like would people really prefer to pay $60 for a visually busier game or just a game with RTX and all that jazz that is designed and plays much worse? I guess Cyberpunk is a yes there. Seems a little ridiculous that a game can basically be perfect but not worth full price to people. Obviously, as I said before, if Hollow Knight was $60 it would've stunted the exposure for it, and that whole discussion would've taken over every time the game was brought up unfortunately. This is in the same realm of how certain genres never are seemingly allowed to win GOTY. Gamers just have had weird mental blocks built up over time, and they overvalue how a game looks and undervalue everything else about the game today.

    @El-Shmiablo People only say things have a Flash aesthetic when they mean it in a bad way. That's what people were calling the new Ghosts 'n Goblins game from the trailers. It usually means stuff pops out in an unnatural looking way and doesn't seem to fit into the environment. If we're now going off your revised definition of "Flash is a versatile tool that can look etc." then you're not really saying anything, because that game could look like anything. That's obviously not the kind of Flash aesthetic you meant.

    Hollow Knight's style does not look like floating assets, but instead makes notable elements high clarity for the player. It makes all the information you need to traverse and to perform in combat crisp, so you're not confused over what's a platform or losing attacks you need to dodge in a bunch of visual noise, like what happens with Ori sometimes. Honestly, it Ori wasn't literally a beaming beacon of light, it would be a horrible style for a game, because you'd constantly lose your character among everything, so at least that was a smart decision on the devs' part.

    Honestly, you do sound like you solely value visuals when it comes to a game's price point, which also as far as I've come to know you from these forums seems to track accurately as well. More importantly, that's how you just made it sound. Don't use matter of fact statements if they don't reflect how you actually feel.

  • Banned

    Wonderful strawman you are building up there.

    There are many reasons for why I believe games should cost as much as they do. Graphics are a contributing factor to a game's production values, yes. Art style, content, and many other factors contribute to that as well. As it stands, I have not seen anything about Dread that leads me to believe it is worth paying 60 buckerinos for.

    In the future, please try to have your discussions with me and not whatever person you've built up in your head.

  • @el-shmiablo said:

    Graphics are a contributing factor to a game's production values, yes.

    Art style

    Also visuals.

    content, and many other factors

    You got pretty vague immediately after there. Not making the strongest case right now.

  • This post is deleted!

  • Banned

    @mbun Lumping graphics and art style together is dumb.
    For instance, Persona 5 has a fantastic art style but bad graphics.

    Also, I don't really care if you think I'm making a strong case or not. I and others have expressed disappointment and that is all there really is to it. I'm sorry we can't all blindly and endlessly felate Nintendo like some people like to do.

    But hey, keep trying. You'll figure it out some day.

  • @el-shmiablo said:

    I'm sorry we can't all blindly and endlessly felate Nintendo like some people like to do.

    I don't want this either, but you constantly doing the opposite is just as bad, especially when you pretend you aren't.

  • @el-shmiablo said in Metroid Dread thread:

    I'm sorry we can't all blindly and endlessly felate Nintendo like some people like to do.

    I'll do it with my eyes open if it means more Metroid

  • Banned

    @e_zed_eh_intern I love Metroid and am excited for Dread, but am disappointed that it looks rather low effort and costs full price.


  • I'm having deja vu back to when Rayman Origins was announced, the exact same arguments. That was a full priced effort in my personal opinion and I have a feeling this will be too.