The EZA Forum Hall of Greats (September 2021)

  • Okay, here is everything we've had so far. Simply click on the highlighted text to go to the referenced post.

    Apex Legends

    Final Fantasy VII

    Grand Theft Auto: Vice City

    Tony Hawk's Underground

    The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask

    Prince of Persia: The Sands of Time

    Katamari Damacy

    I have copied this to the original post as well for ease of access. If I missed anything or got something wrong, please let me know. It's a lot of stuff!

  • @brannox In answers to your questions:

    1.) Vice City has the GTA formula underpinning its sandbox, the 80s veneer just dresses GTA up stylishly. If you don't like the 80s there's still plenty to enjoy thanks to an excellent emphasis on destruction and many diverse diversions that will keep players busy.

    2.) No other GTA feels as immersed in a time period like Vice City. Besides that though you can brandish all manner of DIY equipment and use it as weaponry, I haven't seen another GTA give you hammers, machetes or cleavers as weapons. There's also a focus in Vice City that the other games lack because you have the story's ultimate goal of tracking down who stole Sonny Forelli's money, whereas other GTA games you have to venture far and the ultimate goal is lost thanks to divergent storylines. As for what Vice City does better than all other GTA games-it puts the focus on mayhem, the aspect where GTA thrives most. In GTA 3 you're basically a bitch boy running errands, in San Andreas personal motivations take you to new cities and away from the core storyline problems, in IV there isn't a clear main villain and in V there isn't an established villain from the beginning of the game, you spend time with three wildly different protagonists and while there is an emphasis on destruction en masse, it bundles a lot in that the destructiveness can be overshadowed by many other things.

  • Sorry people for not responding yet to anything. I'll do my best by the weekend. (And if not, there'll go my points, which is fair.)

  • @sentinel-beach Take your time! You've still got almost a week.

  • Question for @ffff0 @Brannox @JDINCINERATOR @DIPSET @Oscillator @Sentinel-Beach @Capnbobamous : Tell me about the Shotgun?

  • @shoulderguy There is a shotgun in Vice City and it has the blast of a 5 volcanic explosions going off at the same time right into the target's face.

  • Respond to @Shoulderguy about shotguns in Apex Legends.

    I prefer automatic weapons and fighting at mid-distance, so my experience with shotguns is mostly on receiving end. There are 4 shotguns in the game: one automatic shotgun pistol, one automatic shotgun and two non-automatic shotguns. They all shoot different amount of pellets arranged in different shape with different spread, so each one requires slightly different handling to be the most effective. In experienced hands 2-3 shotguns shot will down fully healed and fully shielded Legend that was foolish enough to get too close. And just like with any other in-game weapon, sound and feedback are very good.

  • @shoulderguy said in The EZA Forum Hall of Greats (September 2021):

    Question for @ffff0 @Brannox @JDINCINERATOR @DIPSET @Oscillator @Sentinel-Beach @Capnbobamous : Tell me about the Shotgun?

    There are no guns in Majora's Mask. The closest thing to a shotgun is probably the Deku Scrub's bubble (the weakest projectile weapon in the game), which has to be charged, consumes a bit of magic, moves kind of slow, and does as much damage as expected of a magic spitball.

    If you want to blow stuff up, there are regular bombs, the Bombchu which runs straight and sticks to any angle of terrain until the fuse runs out, the Blast Mask which gives Link the power of one bomb (with a short recharge) at any time, though it does a bit of damage to him (which gets negated if you raise your shield, somehow), and the biggest blast comes from the Powder Keg, which you can only carry one of at a time, is expensive, and can only be used by the Goron. It has a long fuse, but can be set off by shooting it with something. Its limitations mean you're likely to only ever use it for an objective that requires it rather than attacking enemies.

  • @shoulderguy I've gotta level with you dude I'm quite disappointed you didn't ask about handguns, because if you did I'd have explained the power they had and mentioned how Ricardo Diaz used his to mess up his VCR because it wouldn't eject although it wasn't plugged in. Gotta sympathise with him though he couldn't watch his favourite El Burro movie.

  • @Shoulderguy regarding Final Fantasy VII's Shotgun:

    The Shotgun is the first weapon you can buy and the second weapon you can find for Vincent (you can happen across a gun for Vincent MANY hours before you even reach him by opening a particular chest in Kalm). It has a decent attack stat (48), high hit percentage (112%), and a terrible magic stat (12). It has only two linked materia slots with an average materia growth rate. It's located in Rocket Town, for sale for 3,100 gil, and is one of the few weapons across the entire game where if you choose to not buy it, it becomes permanently inaccessible. Overall, it's only better than Vincent's starting weapon and dependent on your playstyle, maybe obsolete by the time you can get to it.

  • @Shoulderguy I edited my response to your question, as I remembered that the Slingshot from Ocarina of Time is not in Majora's Mask.

  • Follow-up question to @Oscillator about The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask.

    Previously I’ve asked you what positive aspects time loop mechanic bring to this game and what makes drawbacks of having time loop mechanic less dreadful than they seem from the outside? You’ve explained why this mechanic is less stressful than it seems, but you haven’t said what presence of this mechanic adds to the game. Can you talk about that?

  • @Shoulderguy

    There isn’t a shotgun in THUG but there is a mode where you kick flip to shoot a fireball at your friend who then gets knocked down and spills blood.

    And you can grind Russian tanks in the Moscow level or add them to your created park.

  • @ffff0 said in The EZA Forum Hall of Greats (September 2021):

    Follow-up question to @Oscillator about The Legend of Zelda: Majora's Mask.

    Previously I’ve asked you what positive aspects time loop mechanic bring to this game and what makes drawbacks of having time loop mechanic less dreadful than they seem from the outside? You’ve explained why this mechanic is less stressful than it seems, but you haven’t said what presence of this mechanic adds to the game. Can you talk about that?

    Most of the NPCs in the game have their own personal schedule. They open up their businesses, go to meetings, make deliveries, and generally move around, usually just within the central hub of Clock Town, but sometimes in to/out of the outer regions as well, with their dialogue changing depending on where they are/what they're doing/what day it is. Learning these schedules to earn masks is the other half of the game aside from the main adventure.

    The time loop also adds constant meaning to Link's adventure, as the moon gets physically closer each day, the music in Clock Town gets more intense, and NPCs panic more. The most atmospheric part of the game is the final hours of the last day each cycle, where a special countdown timer appears, the music changes through the entire world, the rumbling caused by the gravity of the moon is almost constant, and the NPCs reach the end of their schedules, hide in their homes, and enter peak acceptance/denial/fatalism/regret. Then Link goes back to the start of the cycle, and everything's bright and sunny again.

    These schedules and waves of emotions are almost unique in the Zelda series. Breath of the Wild does have daily schedules for some NPCs, and strong emotions attached to the memories and some sidequests, but these elements are FAR more pronounced in Majora's Mask.

    The time loop also gives a fresh feeling to the progression of the main adventure. It isn't a huge difference from other Zelda games, but clearing a lengthy pre-dungeon quest or dungeon close to the end of a cycle, getting a new key item, then starting a new cycle and using the key item to access the next area has a really nice rhythm.

    There aren't many moments like this, but one of the best expressions of the time loop is the ranch where you find your horse. For the first third of the game, you can't get into the ranch until the third day because a giant rock is blocking the way and a man is slowly chipping away at it. But by the third day, something has happened to a young girl at the ranch, leaving her in a catatonic state, devastating her older sister, and stopping you from getting your horse. But then you get the ability to blow up the giant rock on the first day, and get to experience and help prevent the event that caused the travesty.

  • @shoulderguy There is no shotgun per se, but the game does frequently shoot you with love.

  • Gonna separate my questions into two games a post.

    Question for @ffff0 regarding Apex Legends:

    You mention that there is a story and that characters have interactions with each other, but since this is a multiplayer only game clearly that can't be the focus. Is there enough narrative there to make you truly interested in what happens next, or is the narrative completely unrelated to your enjoyment of the game?

    Question for @Brannox regarding FF7:

    Final Fantasy VII is one of those games that has been frequently lauded as one of the best of all time, and Square Enix knows this. It's been rereleased a thousand times, there is a CGI anime movie, spinoff games, and now a remake. Do you think FF7 suffers because of this over-saturation, because as a property it has to now carry all of this extra weight?

  • Question for @JDINCINERATOR regarding GTA Vice City:

    Grand Theft Auto has a habit of leaning far too heavily into immature, on-the-nose humor, to the point where I think a lot of the neat world-building is somewhat invalidated by the jokes. How do you feel about the humor and the way in which it is integrated into the game?

    Regarding T.H.U.G.

    Rather than desperately trying to find a question to ask, I'm just gonna say I don't have one. Got no burning questions that need answering. Good presentation Dipset!

  • Question for @Oscillator regarding Majora's Mask:

    You mention in your response to ffff0 that your enjoyment of the game increased a lot with the use of a guide. Do you think the game is a worse experience if you play it blind?

    Question for @Sentinel-Beach regarding Sands of Time:

    How's the difficulty? I know the whole gimmick of the series is that you can rewind time, but does this make the combat and traversal too easy? Are the stakes still there?

  • @capnbobamous Vice City's humor is what give it it's zest as GTA game. All the parodying and immature jokes might seem like it could crack the 80s flavour of Vice City but I think it coincides wonderfully with it. Just take the band Love Fist-a five-piece Scottish metal band where each of the five members' names are slang for the word "penis". Yes it's very immature and on-the-nose, but the flare presented by the band and the lunacy that ensues when you do missions for them are perfect for a GTA game. I think what makes GTA is the immaturity and stupidity, without it there's not so much of a direct contrast to the real world and therefore not so much parody. The directness is what can make the humor in GTA so enjoyable I find, yes it's very often crude but GTA revels in that and I love that Vice City is the first GTA game to truly capture it.

  • Respond to @capnbobamous question about investment to the narrative in Apex Legends.

    I think there’s more than enough narrative in Apex Legends, but since game never pushes it into your face, the level of investment will be different depending on whether you are interested in this stuff. For me personally, this level is pretty high, and it only grew over time. When I’ve started playing Apex Legends, heroes were just appearances and sets of abilities. Then I’ve noticed that each character not just have multiple unique voice lines for each action, but also several versions of each voice line (variations in intonation, an extra word, a pause – stuff like that). This sold me an idea that these characters aren’t just player’s obedient avatars – they are real people that react differently, depending on what’s going on around them. Then, as I was playing more and saw more character interactions, I’ve started to discover different layers of their personalities, histories, and relationships. Eventually my investment became so deep, that I’ve took effort to read entire Apex Legends wiki to learn about earlier seasons’ events that I’ve missed.

    So, to answer your question, yes, narrative is an important part of my enjoyment of this game, and I do care what happen next with my favorite characters. For example, a couple of seasons ago Revenant secretly swore to annihilate anyone whom Loba may eventually love with all her heart. So, when I saw that in current season Loba’s relationships with Valkyrie evolved from mutual interest to publicly expressed affection, my immediate reaction was “Oh no, keep it quiet girls! This will end poorly for both of you!”