@oscillator

1. Hmm to be honest, I’ve never heard the take that the post THPS4 levels became unwieldy.

I think most seasoned Tony Hawk fans agree that THUG has some of the best if not the best level design in the entire series. I can safely say Moscow is my favourite level in the whole series, but I’ll put Manhattan, New Jersey, and Hawaii up there in my ranks before I go to any levels from earlier entires. And I think that fantastic level design extended into to THUG2 before taking a dip in quality.

Not appeal to authority, but I’ll just throw it in there that YouTuber Squared Eyed Jak does a lot of Tony Hawk coverage and he ranked every single 200+ Tony Hawk level across all games from worst to best and THUG’s Manhattan was his #1 with 3 THUG levels appearing in his top 10.

Why?

I think it’s because they aren’t just aimlessly big but are the most well thought out in the series. A level like New Jersey can take you from the ground near the abandoned houses up onto the roofs then onto power lines, then back down into the school yard fences and playground structures, then onto the massive bridge, into a long and fast hospital loop, into a train yard, back to the hospital, back across the bridge and the loop continues.

And it’s not just the overall lines but it’s the amount of detail within the lines and the level. There are so many quality individual spots within any given level that it’s almost a game in itself to make choices on how to combo between all of them. It’s interesting, allows for a personal sense of play and exploration, and just way deeper than any other THPS game.

THUG levels by far have the best combo lines in the whole series. Some of the earlier games have cool levels but they don’t compliment the fundamentals of the game like THUG’s spots and lines levels do.

—

A lot of the fundamentals of THUG’s design and early THPS design appears in sequels and especially in THP8 which combines a lot of the games together. I actually really like THP8’s goal structure for stuff like Bronze, Silver, Gold medals for things like “longest grind” because those types of goals encourage you to extract the most out of the level itself. But ultimately, THP8 suffers really really badly from having boring and empty levels. We’re talking wide open spaces with nothing to interact with. Compare that to Manhattan where you have so many options for objects to skate on, THP8 feels like an empty open world. So the game relies too heavily on the goals to have fun. Whereas THUG is fun to be in by virtue of the level design, the stat challenges, and spread of goal variety.

THPS4 also shares some of THUGs design but it was still figuring out the identity of this type of game. Some of the levels like Zoo had such little flow between spots that it was almost difficult to make fun goals. The goals were rigid like doing multiple trick call outs on the same half pipe. But it definitely has its shining moments like the post-game extremely difficult score challenges and such. I think THPS4 started the job, THUG finished it.

THUG2 has the same good qualities of level design as THUG but I don’t think it has as many great levels or goals.

THAW has some amazing levels and others that are big and aimless. Los Angeles, Beverly Hills, and Downtown basically feel like the same level because they are just city streets with a few interwoven ramps.

So all this comparing is to just make the overall point that THUG’s level design isn’t good because it’s bigger. It’s good because it’s by far more thought out than the other games in the series, and especially the games starting at and after THPS4.

@sentinel-beach

I appreciate that answer. If I recall, I also liked the tone of Sands of Time above the sequels.

One more question (I think we're allowed to ask two questions, right?).

I have Sands of Time on GC. I haven't played it in years. Do you think the combat holds up in general and is generally enjoyable by today's standards?

Last movie thread post but in the F1 forum instead:

I watched the documentary Schumacher on Netflix Friday night. (C+)

It's... fine.

The whole movie can be summarized in one of the final scenes with Schumacher's wife who says something to the tune of, "Michael protected us throughout his career. He always said, 'private is private' so we are doing everything to protect him at this stage in his life." And in that, we really never get to learn more about Schumacher, the person, because his personal life is still intimately private.

So we got a pretty solid summary of his early F1 years and his desire to switch to Ferrari for the challenge. It glosses over the 4 championships in a row because the main focus are those early years. But most of this can be learned just by watching the F1 YouTube page.

Schumacher allegedly donated millions of money to charities in secret. We're talking a substantial amount of his earnings. He is also a certifiable head case. We never really got to know much about why he is the way he is. What makes him so charitable? What makes him such a thrill seeker? Why can't he ever admit he's wrong? You never get anything more than Michael Schumacher, race car driver. They don't even do a fantastic job of explaining his greatness in context of F1 and motorsport.

It's fine enough but not a very compelling doc. In typical Netflix fashion, every interview is a sit down. Talking heads kinda thing. A lot of the archive footage is nice, but it's a pretty bland movie.

Splitgate

Finally tried it. The Halo 3 comparisons are blown out of proportion. I'd say it definitely takes Halo series game modes verbatim (SWAT, Oddball, etc) as well as the Halo shield regen, AND the guns perform extremely similarly (and share the same names). But it feels more Halo-inspired than anything else. It's solid for what it is: a F2P arena shooter with and old school attitude while feeling modern both aesthetically and in control.

I guess what bothers me is that it's really simple. Battle Rifle is a 3-headshot kill. Carbine is about 5 body shots. AR is about a full clip. But there isn't really much depth here. There isn't much reason to use a 3-burst BR when you can't throw a nade then finish them off with one headshot. What difference does it make when the TTK is very similar between all weapons and the only possible damage you can do is from the weapons (other than melee). Likewise, every gun feels the same. You don't lead shots with BR or have much performance difference between each gun. Even the Rocket Launcher has barely and splash or kick to it.

It doesn't take much to kill or be killed which actually is an interesting decision. It adds a solid difference between itself and Halo or even COD with the TTK, but again, I think this simplifies the game too much. There isn't much strategic depth when rushing to get kills is the easiest way to win. You are better off just turning on someone and firing right back at them than you are to use your tools like jetpack or portals.

One nice gameplay decision is fast weapon switching. So you can get into situations where you have 2 shots on a guy, then turn to your AR or Shotgun to finish him. It can lead to some twitchy decision making. I found Shotty Snipers mode had a solid pace because the Sniper is way less useful than the Shotgun so you can place a portal, camp, then chase someone down with a Shotgun when they cross your portal which makes for a weird dynamic cause normally Sniper is the much more useful gun.

I feel like it's solid enough for a few hours of fun. And it is legitimately fun. But it's really really simple. This is mostly a sprint and shoot game with a low TTK and samey maps. I don't know how much it can improve without pretty massive gameplay tweaks like more weapons, different TTK and playstyle between guns, less gravity, better implementation of jetpack, and I feel like grenades would completely change the game for the better.

It's definitely onto something by using it's inspirations for something new. I appreciate Splitgate for that. I also think it's onto something with it's fast pace. But I've played 2ish hours and feel like I've seen all I need to see already. Maps don't matter, weapons barely matter, it's hard to turn on enemies which doesn't make for dynamic fights. Weapon placement is also not implemented well into the maps so you'll never be shot at, suddenly find a shotgun, turn on him and get the kill. It ain't happening, you'll just die.

@el-shmiablo

Just opened up the PS Store. Pacer definitely looks good and reviews seem to say it's different enough from Wipeout to avoid clone-status, but it's $54 which seems a bit steep.

I'll wait for a sale but this new Wipeout mobile card game was a good reminder to buy literally any of these futuristic racers other than this new "Wipeout".

@phbz

I've played it. The F1 series is casual enough to have fun with but serious enough to go hardcore. I played the MyCareer and it's a good time. You can adjust the AI and assists to sort of fine tune the challenge to your liking.

Personally, I wish there were more preset difficulty modes so you don't have to trial and error the difficulty settings but once you find a sweet spot, it's not too challenging.

There is also a Casual mode where hitting curbs at the wrong angle or accelerate on grass won't make you spin and retire and other assists like that.

@el-shmiablo

I think it's Pacer based on screenshots. I remember a black and gold UI. Have you played it? I might download that tonight.

@el-shmiablo

Ugh. I'd rather use my smartphone battery to stream a DnB playlist on Apple Music.

I recall seeing pretty solid pre-release footage of an indie PC game from the actual former Wipeout developers but I haven't heard about it in a long time or remember the name.

@Shoulderguy

There isn’t a shotgun in THUG but there is a mode where you kick flip to shoot a fireball at your friend who then gets knocked down and spills blood.

And you can grind Russian tanks in the Moscow level or add them to your created park.

Kotaku: Splitgate Developers Get $100M Venture Capital Investment

I still haven't played Splitgate but considering everybody says it is quite literally a Halo 3 clone and they mean it in the best possible way; this is wonderful news.

They will stay independent, likely won't have too much investor meddling in the creative considering the game is basically already finished.

If Halo Infinite sucks, 343 can dissolve and we'll always have Splitgate.